The Great Repeal Bill

  • Thousands of EU laws on everything from workers' rights to the environment are to be transferred into UK law as the country gears up for Brexit.


    Brexit Secretary David Davis said the Great Repeal Bill would allow the UK Parliament and Welsh, Scottish and Northern Ireland administrations to scrap, amend and improve laws.


    It would also end the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice.


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-39439554
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    The Great Repeal Bill - the greatest misnomer ever.


    Nothing is bloody repealed. All EU law will be incorporated into ours.


    My grasp of English is rudimentary at best, but even I know the difference between incorporation and repeal.


    Why isn't this called The Great Incorporation Bill?

  • I must admit, I thought that EU laws had already been incorporated into UK law.....however, the Great Repeal bill is to identify all EU legislation such that in the future, i.e post Brexit, individual items of (EU) legislation that are considered undesirable for whatever reason can then be repealed.......hence the use of the word 'repeal' in the title.

  • That's interesting Stevlin. I'll have to check.


    My understanding was that it is to incorporate EU law. As we're already members of the EU and by certain EU treaties, EU law up until now was our law too, but that will change when we leave the EU and the Bill is needed to incorporate all that law into ours.


    Edit: Quick check and it is to incorporate EU law into ours. David Davis is about to start discussing this soon on BBC Parliament/the news channels.


    As far as EU law post Brexit, Stevlin, it won't matter to us. That's why we're leaving the EU, so that their law doesn't apply here post Brexit.

  • Section 2(1) of the European Communities Act 1972 states that: [INDENT]All such rights, powers, liabilities, obligations and restrictions from time to time created or arising under the Treaties, and all such remedies and procedures from time to time provided for by or under the Treaties, as in accordance with the Treaties are without further enactment to be given legal effect or used in the United Kingdom shall be recognised and available in law, and be enforced, allowed and followed accordingly; and the expression 'enforceable Community right' and similar expressions shall be read as referring to one to which this subsection applies.


    .......................................................................................................................................................


    The above suggests that when we leave, EU law will still be incorporated in UK legislation.......and will thus apply until such legislation is removed from the UK statutes......thus, EU initiated law will indeed still apply when we leave the UK........and will continue to apply until repealed.[/INDENT]

  • Section 2(1) of the European Communities Act 1972 states that: [INDENT]All such rights, powers, liabilities, obligations and restrictions from time to time created or arising under the Treaties, and all such remedies and procedures from time to time provided for by or under the Treaties, as in accordance with the Treaties are without further enactment to be given legal effect or used in the United Kingdom shall be recognised and available in law, and be enforced, allowed and followed accordingly; and the expression 'enforceable Community right' and similar expressions shall be read as referring to one to which this subsection applies.


    .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .


    The above suggests that when we leave, EU law will still be incorporated in UK legislation.......and will thus apply until such legislation is removed from the UK statutes......thus, EU initiated law will indeed still apply when we leave the UK........and will continue to apply until repealed.[/INDENT]
     


    No, that 1972 Act in itself, is getting repealed Stevlin. That's the whole point of Brexit, so we are no longer subject to EU law post Brexit. It will get repealed as part of the Great Repeal Act.


    You may recall that the Supreme Court case rested on this act, because the remainers were arguing that once Article 50 is triggered, the 1972 Act would be repealed, thus removing all the rights and responsibilities of European law that is "bestowed" upon us.

  • I must admit, I thought that EU laws had already been incorporated into UK law.....however, the Great Repeal bill is to identify all EU legislation such that in the future, i.e post Brexit, individual items of (EU) legislation that are considered undesirable for whatever reason can then be repealed.......hence the use of the word 'repeal' in the title.


    Coming back to this Stevlin, after my last response to you, this "Repeal" bill actually does several things:


    It does repeal the UK European Acts including the 1972 Act.
    It incorporates The European Court of Justice rulings into UK law. Up until now, the European Court was able to pass law over us because our parliament enacted that right into UK law. That right will now get withdrawn and so all European directives/case law etc will get incorporated into our law.
    All UK Acts that incorporate elements of European law will be amended to reflect that EU law will no longer be applied to us.


    It's basically the most complex thing ever and you can bet lawyers will have a field day with this lot and make them richer than ever!

  • The way I understand it is that since it would be impossible to repeal the thousands of bit of EU legislation that are now part of our laws, incorporating them all into our law for now and then either repealing each one as and when it becomes necessary and leaving the ones we approve of on the statute book is the only way to do it, as in this case........


    "Britain has begun to take back control from Brussels as David Davis announced that the first EU law to be scrapped after Brexit will be a charter that helps criminals avoid deportation."
    Revealing details of the forthcoming Great Repeal Bill, Mr Davis told MPs that the controversial EU Charter of Fundamental Rights will be dropped on the day Britain leaves Europe.


    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/new…ritain-repeals-powers-eu/


    We can't actually repeal it now anyway and if we tried to we'd find some numpty only too willing to drag the whole issue through the courts.


    Further down the article that bloody Sturgeon woman is off again ..............


    Meanwhile Nicola Sturgeon, the Scottish First Minister, came up with a new tactic to frustrate Brexit by threatening to veto the Great Repeal Bill in the Scottish Parliament.

  • That's right Morgan, it's mainly a incorporation bill.


    But unlike what I said in my original reply to Stevlin, it does repeal some laws, ie the European related ones.

  • We can't actually repeal it now anyway and if we tried to we'd find some numpty only too willing to drag the whole issue through the courts.


    When you need a rich remoaner who should pop up but:



    Source linky


    I wish she'd dry up and blow away.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

    4312-gwban-gif


  • :D


    There's something going on with her.... She's getting backing from....


    (I shan't say any more as I'm the owner here and she's highly litigious)


    She may have a point, Government ministers are taking it upon herself to change massive swathes of law, but it is not for her to decide this. As I hinted, there's more going on here. She also said she might go to the Supreme Court at the end of Brexit, if parliament doesn't get a "good enough" say in the final deal.

  • Coming back to this Stevlin, after my last response to you, this "Repeal" bill actually does several things:


    It does repeal the UK European Acts including the 1972 Act.
    It incorporates The European Court of Justice rulings into UK law. Up until now, the European Court was able to pass law over us because our parliament enacted that right into UK law. That right will now get withdrawn and so all European directives/case law etc will get incorporated into our law.
    All UK Acts that incorporate elements of European law will be amended to reflect that EU law will no longer be applied to us.


    It's basically the most complex thing ever and you can bet lawyers will have a field day with this lot and make them richer than ever!


    Indeed - it would appear that by introducing the European 1072 Act, the UK merely accepted primacy of EU law over UK legislation, - however, this appears to be contrary to http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8160808.stm - which states - "Member states are responsible for ensuring that their national legislation is consistent with European law. Where it is not, they must amend existing provisions, and introduce such new law as necessary." This quote from the BBC site was written by a lawyer - and does appear to suggest that national legislation has to be amended in accordance with EU Directives .......and of course your post also references the fact that EU Acts ARE incorporated into UK law............

  • It's a real spaghetti of a mess to untangle. Perhaps that's why Cameron et all, wanted to stay in the EU as they knew it would be very difficult to untangle us from them completely. It will certainly take a lot longer than two years to untangle and amend forty years of law.

  • There's something going on with her.... She's getting backing from....


    (I shan't say any more as I'm the owner here and she's highly litigious)


    Do what the newspapers do. " An unconfirmed but usually reliable source is reported to have said that she is getting backing from ........................... This cannot be confirmed at the moment but ............ had not denied the report at the time of printing." ;)

  • " An unconfirmed but usually reliable source is reported to have said that she is getting backing from RUSSIA (the bastards). This cannot be confirmed at the moment but SHE, not that she'll see this anyway had not denied the report at the time of printing."


    Will that do? :D

  • But seriously, I think Putin might be behind her, although she may not necessarily be aware of it.


    He wants to cause as much chaos as possible for Western countries

  • It's the Bill everyone has been waiting for and its coming today, but will not be debated until September, but hey ho, it's not as if its a complicated task to repeal thousands of EU and UK laws and incorporate them into one new law, is it...?

  • The first paragraph from the Bill:

    Repeal of the European Communities Act 1972



    The European Communities Act 1972 is repealed on exit day.

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    It's what we have all been waiting for and finally it's in writing and hopefully a future law.

  • So, the people who have spent 40 years whining about how the EU is an undemocratic bureaucracy, which has strangled British business and culture with it's unnecessary red tape, now reckon the whole ting can be overturned by a single law, with minimal Parliamentary debate, and all the details to be sorted out by the old boy network in Westminster and Whitehall.


    Do they not see the blindingly obvious contradiction?

  • So, the people who have spent 40 years whining about how the EU is an undemocratic bureaucracy, which has strangled British business and culture with it's unnecessary red tape, now reckon the whole ting can be overturned by a single law, with minimal Parliamentary debate, and all the details to be sorted out by the old boy network in Westminster and Whitehall.


    Do they not see the blindingly obvious contradiction?

    It may be a single Act, but it is an all embracing one, which will enable the UK , post Brexit, to remove those EU laws which the UK Executive/Parliament deem unnecessary or wasteful, piece by piece.

    It is a very sensible approach, and makes the legislative transition process far more efficient.

  • So, the people who have spent 40 years whining about how the EU is an undemocratic bureaucracy, which has strangled British business and culture with it's unnecessary red tape, now reckon the whole ting can be overturned by a single law, with minimal Parliamentary debate, and all the details to be sorted out by the old boy network in Westminster and Whitehall.


    Do they not see the blindingly obvious contradiction?

    It's clearly a practical step to stop the chaos that would otherwise ensue. Once complete voters can decide where to go in future. Seems sensible to me...in fact it seems the obvious route.

  • So, the people who have spent 40 years whining about how the EU is an undemocratic bureaucracy, which has strangled British business and culture with it's unnecessary red tape, now reckon the whole ting can be overturned by a single law, with minimal Parliamentary debate, and all the details to be sorted out by the old boy network in Westminster and Whitehall.


    Do they not see the blindingly obvious contradiction?

    It's a good point.


    There will be more Brexit related laws to come, this is just the general one to repeal the '72 European Act and incorporate all existing law into ours. But there's lots, lots more to come.

  • It may be a single Act, but it is an all embracing one, which will enable the UK , post Brexit, to remove those EU laws which the UK Executive/Parliament deem unnecessary or wasteful, piece by piece.

    It is a very sensible approach, and makes the legislative transition process far more efficient.

    And its needed too, so essential as well as efficient. We have to repeal the '72 Act and state in law, that all existing EU law up to now will be incorporated into out law. Much of it already is, but when we come out of Europe, this has to be explicitly stated.

  • The point being that once these EU laws are actually UK laws they can then be selectively amended or repealed. Until then we're powerless to stop EU dictats.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

    4312-gwban-gif

  • Lets hope we leave so we can choose our own laws going forward, but the front page story on the BBC (Tony Blair interfering again) gives a reason why we may not. I'll post a new thread about it soon.

  • OK, right in the middle of watching this debate, but three main themes appear to the main talking points in the debate so far:


    • Many Labour MPs want to squash Brexit. They're blatant about, ie like Hilary Benn, but others are more pragmatic like Yyette Cooper and other ex Blairites. Obviously, Kate Hoey is very pro the bill and warned her colleagues not to derail the bill. LIb Dem spokesmen Tom Brake wants a clause in the bill to state that if MPs don't like the deal, then the UK should have the option to stay in the EU. That will be the bun fight in 2019 along with any court action that Gina MIller might start, to derail Brexit under the auspices that the deal isn't good enough. Watch out for that nonsense starting by summer 2018, if not earlier.
    • Concern over the divorce bill and negotiation tatics by the EU. Lots of debate over that.
    • The main issue though and the one that May needs to be careful with, is concern from many MPs, (including many of her own backbenchers, like Cameron's people who she sacked like Nicki Morgan and Dominic Grieve) in that May is using so called Henry VIII powers to grab power for the government and not allow proper scrutiny of legislation. MPs are concerned that the legislation, as it currently, will not allow them to "take back control." Warning shots have been fired by several Tory MPs including leavers on this matter. Overall unity thought among Tory MPS that if the legislation gets amened in committee stage, it will pass.


    Another theme arising is one of agriculture and environment. Basically much "our" legislation on this comes from Brussels and the government will have separate primary legislation for these areas. Some Tory MPs say this will be one of the biggest benefits of Brexit to have this law on these subjects made in the UK post Brexit.


    Concern over parity of UK legislation with EU legislation post Brexit. MPs are concerned on how this will work. For our business' to do business with the EU, they need to work within EU rules, but will UK legislation remain on parity with EU law post Brexit, ie will we will keep updating our own laws once Brexit happens to remain in line with EU law?


    Labour going heavily at employment rights and Human rights law etc, say this is at risk post Brexit.

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