Will Scotland leave the UK?

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  • "Surging" support for Scottish independence could force the UK government to allow a referendum, Nicola Sturgeon is to say.

    Cameron gave the Scots a vote on Scottish independence and they chose to remain in the UK. He said it was once in a generation vote, so why does Sturgeon and her SNP colleagues think once in a generation means every few years?


    Will she ever give up on this?

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  • Cameron gave the Scots a vote on Scottish independence and they chose to remain in the UK. He said it was once in a generation vote, so why does Sturgeon and her SNP colleagues think once in a generation means every few years?


    Will she ever give up on this?

    Like a turd that won't flush , no.

  • Will somebody please explain why being independent of the sassenach is wonderful as is then giving everything away to Juncker and co and becoming subservient to the EU?

  • Will somebody please explain why being independent of the sassenach is wonderful as is then giving everything away to Juncker and co and becoming subservient to the EU?

    That is indeed the complete bollox of this. The woman is so obsessed with an independant scotland she cant see the basic contradiction of then wanting to become a slave of the EU.


    The Eu has already said Scotland has to leave the EU with the UK first, and then woudl have to undergo same tests as anyone else to rejoin, and woudl be compelled to join the euro.


    Last time they tried, they entire argument was predicated on thwe back of them having £15B a year oil money. Thats all gone. Independance would have to necessitate savage, severe cuts in governement spending - £15B is basically the entire local government budget every year.

    BNot just wave bye bye to free prescriptions, free education, bus passes etc. It'll turn Scotland into Rwanda, economically. The oil industry is gone.


    The last time Scotland got above itself and tried to play with the big boys was 1680, when it tried to colonise Patagonia, and created a colony called New Caledonia. Every family in scotland put money into it, and when it all went pear shaped, and threatened to bankrupt scotland and cause mass starvation, they had to come grovelling to us, and thats how we ended up in union with them. Google "Darian Scheme" if you want to know more.


    The other point here is the EU doesnt want tiny little states breaking away, otherwise you'll get everywhere from catalonia to the crimea declaring independance, and they'll all be net takers of money, which with the second biggest payer about to leave is bad news for them.

  • Cameron gave the Scots a vote on Scottish independence and they chose to remain in the UK. He said it was once in a generation vote, so why does Sturgeon and her SNP colleagues think once in a generation means every few years?


    Will she ever give up on this?

    Why should Sturgeon give up? It was close to 50-50 last time and that was when Britain was in good shape. Today, if I was Scottish I'd be tempted to get off the sinking ship of England & Wales & malevolent Northern Ireland before it sinks. A "can do" independent tax-competitive Scotland could attract a fair amount of investment from abroad. If Scotland can't use the Bank of England-backed pound they can always use the Euro.

  • Why should Sturgeon give up? It was close to 50-50 last time and that was when Britain was in good shape. Today, if I was Scottish I'd be tempted to get off the sinking ship of England & Wales & malevolent Northern Ireland before it sinks. A "can do" independent tax-competitive Scotland could attract a fair amount of investment from abroad. If Scotland can't use the Bank of England-backed pound they can always use the Euro.

    Can do independent ? LMFAO;(, don't you mean fully signed up slave to the EU ! , who would man the new EU border with the sinking ship ?

  • Why should Sturgeon give up? It was close to 50-50 last time and that was when Britain was in good shape. Today, if I was Scottish I'd be tempted to get off the sinking ship of England & Wales & malevolent Northern Ireland before it sinks. A "can do" independent tax-competitive Scotland could attract a fair amount of investment from abroad. If Scotland can't use the Bank of England-backed pound they can always use the Euro.

    Well first it not a sinking ship, far from it. But without the £15B you woudl be getting into a sinking lifeboat. And it was switching to the euro that crippled PIIGS, and it would do same to Scotland. Thats the entire issue with the Euro, you cant tie high power economies to low power economies without crippling one of them.


    Countries' economies are evaluated every two years to see if they're strong enough to adopt the euro, using figures such as interest rates, inflation, exchange rates, gross domestic product, and government debt - the so called Convergance Rules, which were gleefully thrown out the window inthe haste to get everyone in the club.


    Countries that don't use the euro maintain the independence of their economies, such as the ability to set their own interest rates and other monetary policies; the flip side of that is that they must manage their own financial crises and can't go to the European Central Bank for assistance. A rich country like the UK has no problem. But PIIGS, up to thier necks in debt, and unable to devalue or print more money, were well fucked.


    Without their own currency, with no control over their domestic interest rates, and now even worse, only limited room for manoeuvre over tax and spending policy, Scotland would have no levers left to pull in a crisis

    Greece was able to borrow on unrealistically good terms for most of the last decade; somewhat surprisingly, national interest rates converged in the wake of the adoption of the euro. This contributed to Greece's accumulation of debt, and only when market forces began to reassert themselves and peripheral yields diverged from core yields did it become clear that Greece's debt burden was unsustainable. Gre kstarted to admit its GDP was lies, and it was far less than started. Greece started to look like a bad risk, and people stopped lending money to it. It got with in a cats whisker of going under, sunk by oceans of borrowed EU money it couldnt afford to pay back


    Greece gave up monetary independence. As it turned out, the super-responsible ECB spent the 2000s making a monetary policy that fitted the laggardly German economy, and which was actually too loose for Greece's economic situation. and thats the key - the euro is managed for the maximum benefit for Germany, and the least concern for everyone else.


    Scotland cant even print its own currency, because to float a currency you need gold to back it, until theres enough confidence in it to engage Fractional Reserve Banking and abandon gold. That takes decades. This means Scotlands credit rating, according to Standard and Poor, would on independance, be F, ie Junk Rating. No one will lend to them except at punative rates, and it immediately falls intothe same trap as Greece. They would have to use Euro, without being part of it. A country with no control over the currency it uses, a disaster waiting to happen at the next recession..


    If Scotland goes indy, the scots can expect to be one of the poorest countries in europe for a generation

  • Cameron gave the Scots a vote on Scottish independence and they chose to remain in the UK. He said it was once in a generation vote, so why does Sturgeon and her SNP colleagues think once in a generation means every few years?


    Will she ever give up on this?

    No. She agrees with the EU, that referendums should be run and re-run until the people give the 'right answer'. Then they will stop and the people will never be given a chance 'to change their minds'!


    Neither Sturgeon or the EU want true democracy. They want complete control, even if it means destroying democracy in order to get it.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • Can do independent ? LMFAO;(, don't you mean fully signed up slave to the EU ! , who would man the new EU border with the sinking ship ?

    I'm sure LMFAO is an acronym for something deeply meaningful and maybe I'll discover what it means but only if I let you WMFT

  • No. She agrees with the EU, that referendums should be run and re-run until the people give the 'right answer'. Then they will stop and the people will never be given a chance 'to change their minds'!


    Neither Sturgeon or the EU want true democracy. They want complete control, even if it means destroying democracy in order to get it.A

    A remain win by one vote would according to many advocating a losers vote be more than enough to justify it and not require a third vote, strange how democracy works in the UK now.

  • Neither Sturgeon or the EU want true democracy. They want complete control, even if it means destroying democracy in order to get it.

    Their like petulant brats who stamp their feet until they either get their own way or get smacked. She's had her smack (the Salmond fiasco) lets hope she doesn't get her own way now.

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  • Apparently Sturgeon want the Scots to have their own currency if they gain independence the truth is they won't be allowed to keep the pound so they have no option to invent their own either that or take the euro from the EU, but only if they are allowed to join the EU as an independent country there is no guarantee they will be allowed to join the EU.

    Young boys in the park jumpers for goalpost that's what footballs all about isn't it.

  • The benefits of independence is they can do what that want, but they also have to fund it.... which is why the SNP have never really been keen on the idea of their own currency until now.

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  • Apparently Sturgeon want the Scots to have their own currency if they gain independence the truth is they won't be allowed to keep the pound so they have no option to invent their own either that or take the euro from the EU, but only if they are allowed to join the EU as an independent country there is no guarantee they will be allowed to join the EU.

    But think of the wonderful independence from the dreadful sassenach !

  • That sums up the SNP in a nutshell. It's not really about independence, they could declare that in a instant if they wanted and go their own way. It's just about bashing the English.

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  • Scotland would have to qualify for EU membership, not that it would be a problem as I am sure the EU would welcome them with open arms just to piss off the UK. However, Scotland would end up like Greece, as I am fairly sure they would have to adopt the Euro. I just cannot imagine the EU admitting them to the EU with a new un-guaranteed currency.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • Scotland would have to qualify for EU membership, not that it would be a problem as I am sure the EU would welcome them with open arms just to piss off the UK. However, Scotland would end up like Greece, as I am fairly sure they would have to adopt the Euro. I just cannot imagine the EU admitting them to the EU with a new un-guaranteed currency.

    They HAVE to adopt the Euro, its in the EU rules. And they bent the rules to let PIIGS in, with disasterous cosequences for those countries.

  • No. She agrees with the EU, that referendums should be run and re-run until the people give the 'right answer'. Then they will stop and the people will never be given a chance 'to change their minds'!


    Neither Sturgeon or the EU want true democracy. They want complete control, even if it means destroying democracy in order to get it.

    Its striaght out the EU Playbook on Repeat Referendums. The Eu has forced revotes on several referendums they didnt like the results of. The most famous was the Irish Euro vote.

  • A remain win by one vote would according to many advocating a losers vote be more than enough to justify it and not require a third vote, strange how democracy works in the UK now.

    A Leave win by one vote is certainly viewed by Horizon as democratically decisive (right H?!). I wonder if this ruthless winner-takes-all approach to democracy will still be insisted upon by Brexiteers if the boot is on the other foot

  • A Leave win by one vote is certainly viewed by Horizon as democratically decisive

    It was far more that one vote and what does this have to do with this topic?

    Scotland would have to qualify for EU membership, not that it would be a problem as I am sure the EU would welcome them with open arms just to piss off the UK. However, Scotland would end up like Greece, as I am fairly sure they would have to adopt the Euro. I just cannot imagine the EU admitting them to the EU with a new un-guaranteed currency.

    I think the EU will be gone before any chance of Scotland becoming independent, this is all just sabre rattling by Ms Sturgeon again.

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  • A Leave win by one vote is certainly viewed by Horizon as democratically decisive (right H?!). I wonder if this ruthless winner-takes-all approach to democracy will still be insisted upon by Brexiteers if the boot is on the other foot

    You seem to be hard of understanding , leave won , if the country had been moronic and voted remain that would of been that for me , so get over it!

  • A Leave win by one vote is certainly viewed by Horizon as democratically decisive (right H?!). I wonder if this ruthless winner-takes-all approach to democracy will still be insisted upon by Brexiteers if the boot is on the other foot

    But thats how democracy works, The majority vote has it. It doesnt matter if the majority is one vote or one billion votes. How else you going to do it? Proportional Representation? We divide the country with a line going from the Wash to the Humber so that the 48% can stay in the EU and everyone north of the line Leaves?


    Idiot idea. idiot comment. And what we DONT allow is multiple votes on same question until the 'right' result is achieved. Thats just taking the piss out of democracy.

  • You seem to be hard of understanding , leave won , if the country had been moronic and voted remain that would of been that for me , so get over it!

    He seems to want to redefine what an election means. Currently it means the winner(s) win. Much prefer this system to alternatives.


    I wonder if this ruthless winner-takes-all approach to democracy will still be insisted upon by Brexiteers if the boot is on the other foot

    I thought you followed current affairs closely....:/


    The boot is on the other foot, the wrong foot. We are being led down a path against the wishes of the majority.


    Now, back to Scotland/the SNP/the charming Ms Sturgeon, anyone?

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  • Generally, I am happy for the Scots to have a referendum every year, if they want it and are willing to pay for it. It may stop some of the whinging and whining, but as we all know, as soon as the 'right answer' is given, then the referendums will stop ... forever! It will be a one way street, unlike the EU referendum ... but then again, we know that the EU referendum would have been the final one ... if Remain had won.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • Although I'm tempted to agree Fidget, we can't be held to ransom by the SNP. If they want a independent country, then perhaps they can go and invade the Orkney islands or something. The matter has been settled, but fanatical nationalists will never accept the 2014 result.


    What matters to most people is the money in their pockets and the SNP are good at spending it. The Scots are gradually tiring of the SNP running Holyrood, so we just need to let that run its full course too.

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  • Although I'm tempted to agree Fidget, we can't be held to ransom by the SNP. If they want a independent country, then perhaps they can go and invade the Orkney islands or something. The matter has been settled, but fanatical nationalists will never accept the 2014 result.


    What matters to most people is the money in their pockets and the SNP are good at spending it. The Scots are gradually tiring of the SNP running Holyrood, so we just need to let that run its full course too.

    The SNP are a bunch of looneys and thugs. Like most fascist parties (and the SNP ARE a fascist group) they have a bunch of thugs to intimidate the opposition, which they deny all linsk to, just like the Brownshirts and Blackshirts - look how Farage was intimidated and trapped in a pub by a howling mob when he went to Scotland. And it wasnt hard to work out they were scots nationalists and thus SNP supporters. Labour has a similar mob of thugs, Momentum.


    In WW2 the SNP leaders were arrested and investigated as fascist sympathisers, because they sent a message to Hitler basically saying "If you invade the Uk , we'll cooperate and run Scotland for you, just like that nice Mr Quisling in Holland, or Mr Vichy in France".

  • If that's the case, then the Scots will see them for what are, eventually.

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  • PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE let the sweaties have independents. Scotland is a drain on the UK purse thanks to the Barnett formula.

    White lives matter