Hong Kong protesters demonstrate against extradition bill

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  • The idea in the minds of Hong Kong protesters that they can change the fundamental political philosophy of its parent government is childishly naive, least of all by the way they are now going about it..


    The protesters should have quit while they were ahead. China already knows it can't make progress much beyond where it is today if it sticks to its uncompromising Marxist system of government. A gentler but more persuasive form of protest would be emigration among the Hong Kong educated young and capital flight among the Hong Kong wealthy, leading to a corresponding decline in inward investment and trade (and Singapore, South Korea and Japan rubbing their hands in gleeful anticipation). . Ultimately it will be witnessing that trend gathering momentum that will give Beijing pause for thought. Whereas what the Hong Kong protesters are persisting in will either land them in prison, hospital or under the ground, and the world will be awash in crocodile tears for about a week.

  • What's not childishly naive is wanting to choose your own leaders, but I agree, the way they are going about it is wrong,. Instead of peaceful protesters, they should arm themselves if they want a change of government, as no other course of action will knock the communist regime off its perch.

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  • Just caught on the news channel that the protesters have moved across the bridge into Kowloon which is still in Hong Kong, but on the Chinese mainland. They're brave.


    The 70th anniversary of the Chinese communist party coming into power is in October, so I wonder how much longer the Chinese government will let this go on. They will not want their big party ruined.

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  • China anniversary: Clashes as Hong Kong protesters defy police ban

    Thousands of people are demonstrating in Hong Kong in defiance of a protest ban for the 70th anniversary of Communist rule in China.

    Fifteen people were hospitalised during the clashes, as tear gas was fired and petrol bombs were thrown.

    Police have also fired live rounds, and there are unconfirmed reports that one protester was shot in the chest.

    CNN has just showed footage of the protestor getting shot at close range in the chest by the policeman. The protestor was hitting the copper on the arm with a pole and as a result, he got shot. If he dies, that crosses a line, but I suspect over the last four months of these protests, the line has already been crossed.


    Meanwhile, in Beijing, they are enjoying their 70th anniversary celebrations, but I bet the communist leaders didn't want images of this shot protester to dominate the headlines and take away all the attention from their big party.


    What next? The Chinese leadership has shown considerable restraint, but as violence has now risen to people getting shot, how much longer will it be before the tanks get sent in?

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  • It will be interesting to see how this finally pans out. I cannot see the authoritarian Chinese backing down or the protesters giving up

    The whole thing could make the Chinese become even more reclusive, and create a draconian clamp dpwn

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • I agree and that's how I see it too now. It's a question of when the tanks go in, not if, especially after these latest events:


    Most of Hong Kong's metro system remains shut after a day which saw stations and businesses attacked in violent anti-government protests.


    Unrest intensified on Friday after a young demonstrator was shot in the leg by a police officer.

    Protesters have also called on people to defy a ban on face masks announced by Ms Lam.

    Second person to be shot with live bullets and after that, a petrol bomb was thrown at the copper setting him alight for a second.


    Really past the point of no return here.

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  • From what I see on the TV reports it seems to be mainly youngsters protesting

    I wonder what the older generations think

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • From what I see on the TV reports it seems to be mainly youngsters protesting

    I wonder what the older generations think

    The older generations will remember Tiananmen Square!

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • The older generations will remember Tiananmen Square!

    Not only Tiananmen Square but the ruthlessness of the communist regime

    You would think that they would try to influence the youngsters

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • They probably do, but youngsters rarely listen and have to learn from experience. I also doubt there will be any reporting of what happened there. It will probably have been wiped from the history books.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • It's a good point that we're only seeing the young and it's completely unknown what the older people think, although I saw on the news the other day that a load of office workers got involved in the protests too for a bit. They were pulling down communist banners, so the discontent does seem to be wider than just the students.

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  • China's President Xi warns attempts to divide China will end in 'crushed bodies and shattered bones' as Hong Kong demonstrators smash up pro-Beijing businesses and barricade the streets in another weekend of protests

    China's tanks are still near the border with HK, but they haven't sent them yet. Any pretence that China is peaceful would be blown to pieces with the world community if China does send the military in. Lets hope they don't.

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  • As a lot of Chinese in Hong Kong feel part of China. I think Hong Kong needs to accept the inevitable with a good grace. The days of drug trading debauchery and high capitalism are probably over.

    You only live twice, or so it seems

    One life for yourself, and one for your dreams


  • As a lot of Chinese in Hong Kong feel part of China. I think Hong Kong needs to accept the inevitable with a good grace. The days of drug trading debauchery and high capitalism are probably over.

    China wouldn't dare to interfere because by doing so, it would make 'Tiananmen Square' seem like a teddy bear's picnic. So I think China will just stand aside and let events take their course until it 'burns itself out'. It's just that it might descend into a state of civil war before that happens.

    There are none who do so much harm as those obsessed with doing good.


    People are far more more likely to believe a lie if they want it to be the truth.

  • Hong Kong was always only a rented place and when that lease ran out I knew this problem would turn up. It will work itself out but there seems to be a rather nasty element among the protesters. Not sure who or what is motivating that.

    You only live twice, or so it seems

    One life for yourself, and one for your dreams


  • Hong Kong was always only a rented place and when that lease ran out I knew this problem would turn up. It will work itself out but there seems to be a rather nasty element among the protesters. Not sure who or what is motivating that.

    You're right, Hong Kong's long lease came to end and the landlord/freeholder (mainland China) decided to change the relationship to a landlord-tenant agreement of good intent, written by politicians and PR execs rather than lawyers. You could see on Takeover Day One, in the displayed attitude of mainland China, that the spirit of Hong Kong entrepreneurship and capitalism was not going to stand in the way of Mainland China's global progress based on a totalitarian government policy. (If and when North Korea finally accomplishes the art of two-faced diplomacy we will have a 2-headed East Asian monster, leaving the rest of the world (except maybe Russia) on Defcom 2


    Protests have become so commonplace that they can only get what they want is by gaining a bigger share of voice, so that a government or large corporation is rattled (I suppose this is why totalitarianism is such an iron glove). Protesting is best staged close to an election (or annual shareholder meeting). The problem is that the actual number protesting is finite, so the protesters have to be more prominent in behaviour, which usually starts with attention-seeking, then being a nuisance, then obnoxious and then violent, which is hardly a way of encouraging once-sympathetic spectators to join the fray.


    In the early stage of Hong Kong protests, mainland China's police tried to act with restraint but as the protesters became more demanding and excitable, with an ever increasing list of demands that belong with an unfettered Western-style democracy, negotiation in search of a face-saving midpoint became futile.


    Young Chinese people look so adorably cute, especially the ones in Hong Kong. Much of the world was on their side. Today I'm so sure.

  • I blame Hong Kong's excess. It became a bit of a glamorous shithole early on in its origins. But that's just my opinion. I am a nature oriented person and a nationalist so I sympathise with the indigenous people there who were basically shoved aside to build the awful skyscraper warren and opium port that Hong Kong became. It is a beautiful place under all that concrete, but the old island has been ruined and so the people will have to decide to make lemonade out of China's intention to absorb what it considers to be its own. As usual, the natives will be ignored. Taiwan will be next.

    You only live twice, or so it seems

    One life for yourself, and one for your dreams


  • Hong Kong was always only a rented place and when that lease ran out I knew this problem would turn up. It will work itself out but there seems to be a rather nasty element among the protesters. Not sure who or what is motivating that.

    My bets are are on the Chinese government.


    That man who was doused in petrol the other day and then set alight is disgusting.

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  • Young Chinese people look so adorably cute, especially the ones in Hong Kong. Much of the world was on their side. Today I'm so sure.

    Which is exactly what the Chinese government want.

    China wouldn't dare to interfere because by doing so, it would make 'Tiananmen Square' seem like a teddy bear's picnic. So I think China will just stand aside and let events take their course until it 'burns itself out'. It's just that it might descend into a state of civil war before that happens.

    I think the Chinese government has played a blinder here, I had expected the tanks to be sent in ages ago, but instead they're just letting things play out, with as I believe, assistance from their own agents doing nasty things to turn world opinion against the protestors.


    Although this containment policy has worked so far, there is a danger of it spreading beyond HK into mainland China itself and it's at that point that civil war could occur, but as long as it's contained in HK, the Chinese authoroties can just say its a local issue.

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  • It's why the new aircraft carriers were built, to take on China. When the first carrier has completed all its trials in 2021, it will be sent straight to the South China Seas, although the way these protests are going, events may happen before then.

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  • It's why the new aircraft carriers were built, to take on China. When the first carrier has completed all its trials in 2021, it will be sent straight to the South China Seas, although the way these protests are going, events may happen before then.

    I watched the series about the the new Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier trials. It was extremely good, and eye opening. Such a dedicated team of people, thousands of them in total.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • I watched the series about the the new Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier trials. It was extremely good, and eye opening. Such a dedicated team of people, thousands of them in total.

    And it can be sunk with all hands by a couple of well-aimed missiles. And Trident will never be used. Future wars won't depend upon ballistics or effing aircraft carriers which don't have any planes on them because we can't afford to buy any.

    There are none who do so much harm as those obsessed with doing good.


    People are far more more likely to believe a lie if they want it to be the truth.

  • It's why the new aircraft carriers were built, to take on China. When the first carrier has completed all its trials in 2021, it will be sent straight to the South China Seas, although the way these protests are going, events may happen before then.

    One of the Fat Controllers missiles and the new aircraft carrier will be toast

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Again, do not get involved in these conflicts. It's why Trump is retreating from them. He is right. No more globo cop. Let them work things out for themselves.

    You only live twice, or so it seems

    One life for yourself, and one for your dreams


  • Just make sure you don't get involved in it.

    That's the last thing the poor bloody HongKongers need - the stupid West getting involved. Everything we get involved in ends up getting 10 times worse than it was!

    There are none who do so much harm as those obsessed with doing good.


    People are far more more likely to believe a lie if they want it to be the truth.

  • Although this containment policy has worked so far, there is a danger of it spreading beyond HK into mainland China itself and it's at that point that civil war could occur, but as long as it's contained in HK, the Chinese authoroties can just say its a local issue.You

    You may well be right about the danger of the protests spreading to mainland China. But I think citizens on the mainland know what China's government can do with protesters once they are a serious threat.


    My view is that there is no point in Beijing discussing the future of HK with its protesters. Sadly, the protesters prove to Beijing the downside of democracy when it is allied to young people's unthinking pursuit of political freedom as an assumed right. It strengthens and justifies Beijing's resolve to beat the protesters into submission and, if necessary, stick them behind bars.


    The irony is that if the protesters had a better sense of proportion, nuance and vision they would realise that Beijing’s seemingly reluctant meagre concessions could have been a first step on a path to a more relaxed style of government. But that path was never going to begin with mob democracy. After all, the difference between totalitarianism and democracy is a scale not a dichotomy. Hong Kong could have become an exception to mainland China, an exception that ultimately would prove the rule.

  • The story is far from over yet, so lets not assume that HK won't become an exception. In a way already is, China has not sent the tanks in, yet.

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