BBC's Newsnight tonight had a major report on Zuma and his potential downfall. He seems like he still has widespread support in countryside areas though.
Just think LW, our media might now just be starting to catch on about what's going on in your country, but you reported about it here first!
Thanks to your forum, H.
Things are jumping over here. This past weekend has seen a huge gathering of Christians, praying for a better South Africa. SA is a roughly 67% practicing Christian nation. This means that most of the rest are nominal or lapsed Christians and a percentage are Hindus, Muslims and Jews, with pockets of Buddhists, pagans and atheists. So, the vast majority are the kind who attend church every Sunday and live Christianity-inspired lives. When they get together with a purpose and a common cause, thunder rolls because they are capable of uniting. This happened at the weekend when almost a million are said to have gathered on a farm outside Bloemfontein to hear an evangelical pastor speak on uniting all citizens against the things going on in the government that are having devastating effects on people's lives.
Apparently, helicopters were landing with visitors every ten minutes on the day and supporters world-wide added their prayers, many from nations overseas. The leader of the opposition and his wife also attended as Mmusi Maimane is a Christian with a Bachelor's degree in Psychology and a Master's degree in Theology.
So, another aspect of the popular uprising against corruption in government has lifted its voice. And it will be a voice that unites many more than mere ideology will. It clasps the issues significant to all people, no matter what their belief system might be. Demands for truth, dedication to service, honesty, and delivery come together in these sort of meetings with a great deal of power. The nation reverberated with evangelical fervour on that day and it will snowball. I've seen calls for smaller prayer meetings held in street communities and elsewhere since the big event. Everyone wants an end to the disgraceful conduct of the government. The people want social justice, economic opportunities, education, and a future for their children. And that is just the beginning of what needs to be done that has been neglected since Mandela left the political stage and the so-called Rainbow Nation fell into disrepute. "It's Time" has become a watchword for Change. Now, no one cares who you are or what you believe in. People are uniting under one banner and that is for the removal of a government and its rotten party that has quite literally emptied the coffers of a once economically powerful nation and created a political elite, financed and motivated by outside interests.
The rural populace is afraid to rebel because they believe they will be worse off if they do, but they are wrong, they will be better off. They need to shed the old cloak of historical injustice and the false coat of many opportunities that was promised to them and join the nation in obtaining something that is actually going to work for them. Fear is always the tyrant's biggest whip. If the people lose their fear they become strong and, often, that strength and that confidence to do something instead of nothing is possible when people unite across their differences. One of the most powerful ways they can do this in South Africa is under the banner of Christ. So be it. If this makes them stronger against injustice and corruption, then may they be successful.
In the long run what matters is whether the government is serving the people and not itself and its various flunkies. This is something that plagues nations world wide. We are hoping that SA can be a nation that stood up with one voice to injustice and corruption and neglect of duty, because what is important is not which political party you support, but whether or not you care enough about the fundamental issues of social justice to have the courage to Unite for Change.
Caledonian Stadium gathering ended on a high note:
Maimane suggested: “55 million of us are not going to be held ransom by one South African called Jacob Zuma”.
Zuma responded by having a party and laughing at those 55 million South Africans.
Next they will be debating the Vote of No Confidence in Parliament. Have to see if he's still laughing then ...
Jewel at the bottom of the world xx.
Just caught the last few minutes of a interview on BBC News' Hardtalk programme and it was SA's policing minster getting grilled. He was asked, "don't you think you're just like a member of the cabin crew of the Titanic going down with the ship." He obviously disagreed...
At last, a BBC person who isn't going to grovel to a dictator's minions.
Just caught the last few minutes of a interview on BBC News' Hardtalk programme and it was SA's policing minster getting grilled. He was asked, "don't you think you're just like a member of the cabin crew of the Titanic going down with the ship." He obviously disagreed...:)
Full interview here BBC radio player and download podcast. Valid for 29 days.
A very good programme and the interviewer doesn't pull the puches.
It's a bit stunning to see Stephen Sackur doing an interview like this as he was so aggressive toward South Africans before that I used to call him Mr Sac Spider.
You cannot, however, expect the Police person in the interview to say anything untoward about the Zupta regime. He'd be toast in minutes, like the others who were fired.
Pretending that all that is needed is a little reform and the BBC lefties' favourite political party would be back on its feet again is also wishing for the moon. The ANC is thoroughly corrupt and Zuma is just the boil that appears when bacteria have created enough of a problem to make themselves manifest. It won't be long before we are all splattered with whatever has been brewing inside that boil over the past two decades.
Nerves are jangling among the despots of Africa as the real people, who have for so long been thoroughly crushed into submission by a variety of self-oriented graspers, demand justice and unify in solidarity to obtain it.
Mmusi Maimane had no sooner landed in Zambia to attend the trial of Zambia's opposition leader than -Quote
"They stormed the plane. Then things got a bit physical when they tried to remove Mr Maimane from the plane. When Mr Maimane tried to reach for his phone, his phone was confiscated by the legal authorities.”
South Africa -Quote
Democratic Alliance leader Mmusi Maimane on Sunday said that leaked Gupta emails published in the weekend papers amounted to concrete proof of a “shadow criminal state in South Africa" which is led by the Gupta and Zuma families.
I suppose it's not that much different in any country LW, except each country is at different stages of "development."
We used to have just one all powerful gangster family here, and they're still knocking around in their palaces and castles... Then we got all the various lords, barons etc, and these days are cabals of powerful families whoo control various industries. So, I guess the only difference is SA has two all powerful groups, whereas the "love" is spread a little more wider here. No wonder extremists coming along whether it be communists, fascists or Islamists etc. It breeds them.
I bet Zuma would get along well with Putin, same ilk.
Zuma is in the pooh at the moment. A second attempt at a vote of no confidence is being planned.
I can't see him lasting, but you would flip if you could see the under the counter deals being done. Worth millions and in some cases billions as backhands for favours and sweeteners for friends. It's pretty frightening and the people from the opposition are very brave to take him on. The whole country is simmering with rage right now. Zuma is sitting there like Jabba the Hutt saying "what have I done wrong?"
Zuma has survived a second vote of no confidence, but only by the skin of his teeth. The matter is still being debated. He's like a resilient barnacle on a ship's hull.
Unfortunately, the misery for many South Africans continues as Jacob Zuma, president of South Africa, has survived another no confidence vote against him. The eight one.
Many South Africans are reeling under the corruption of the ANC government which has led to widespread poverty and stagnation of a once advanced economy.
The vote was close, Zuma won by 198 votes to 177. It would take at least 50 of his MPs to vote against him for him to be chucked out.
Whenever you have one group that dominates over another for such a long time, things eventually explode.
The opposition is not giving up on getting rid of the old crook. He'll go, I'm certain of it. His cronies may be terrified to lose their expense accounts and dodgy dealings but sooner or later the mother of all backlashes will go into action.
Besides, Cyril Ramaphosa is gearing up to take the hot seat from him and he has some serious financial backing.
Meanwhile, we are all going down the financial drain. Wish us luck as you wave us goodbye ...
....our net debt is sky high, and we have an entire generation in the UK who have no concept of interest rates, let alone high ones. When that explodes, it maybe you waving us goodbye as we collapse into "our" own debts.
As for Zuma, the BBC and others did highlight the fact that he won by quite a narrow margin, but he still won.
Never heard of Cyril Ramaphosa, I'll shall google him straight away.
Cyril should have been made Prez when Mandela retired. Job was given to reverse racist comrades from the struggle instead and Cyril was done out of a position he would have used to further the success of SA's transition, rather then to plunge everyone but a strata of political elites into dire straits. Cyril is a business man, not a wannabe chief. This huge difference has kept Ramaphosa from power.
In real terms, the ANC had destroyed itself and the opposition needs to become the next government in order to begin the reversal of that destruction., The major cities under opposition municipal governance are already showing great strides forward, but a general election defeat would finalise the death star that is the ANC. They could have been successful, but they grabbed the cash instead and associated themselves and surrounded themselves with dodgy support, and in Zuma's case, virtually sold the country by means of State Capture to a family of Indians.
I agree with you that Britain is staring its own demise in the face. I was so upset about this way back when I came to support its revival on the net, that I hoped British people might do something wonderful to overturn the damage. Brexit was the great hope. I'm not so sure now that the new voters are going to be capable of comprehending what they are losing by their present indolence on the matter of heritage, survival and the necessity of independence. They seem oblivious to everything that isn't a message on a small screen. That goes for this lot world wide.
It gives the window of opportunity to whichever usurper is waiting for a chance to lop off the head of an ancient nation and weld the body onto the new fascist global market of a few super rich beings who control the great mass of human economic slaves.
Sci-fi imitates life, it seems. Mostly because few are willing to step up to the plate and say the emperors are naked.
Well, it's a start ...Quote
Finally, after almost a decade of ducking and diving, and squandering millions of rands of public money on his own legal fees, President Jacob Zuma will now face 783 charges of corruption, fraud and racketeering for stealing the people’s money.
The Democratic Alliance (DA) welcomes the judgment handed down by the Supreme Court of Appeal (SCA) this morning, which flatly rejected President Jacob Zuma’s appeal of the 2016 North Gauteng High Court ruling that set aside the decision to drop these charges eight and a half years ago. The court found that the decision to drop these charges was borne from undue political considerations and, therefore, irrational.
Today’s judgment is a win for justice, the rule of law, and for South Africa. Jacob Zuma will not defeat the ends of justice. The law applies to all, regardless of status.
The matter is now straightforward. The charges now stand, and a court of law must hear this matter. If the President is innocent, as he proclaims, he ought to let a trial court decide on his innocence. His actions over the last decade smack of a desperate attempt to avoid this eventuality. These are the actions of a man who knows he has a lot to answer for.
783... Shouldn't someone have stopped him after the first seven problems?
I hope for your country, LW, he's on his way out, but who would replace him?
Mmusi Mainane of the Democratic Alliance in the next election, hopefully.
Here, we laugh, because if you don't laugh you cry.
I hope it works out for SA, I really do. But is that fanatical ANC youth leader still around? His name escapes me at the moment, but he's a nazi in all but name and very bad news for the white people in your country.
Julius? He hasn't been ANC Youth Leader for some time. Now he's with the EFF.
Julius isn't a Nazi, he is ostensibly a socialist with heavy commie leanings but mostly he's a rich lad who capitalises on poverty to gain political clout. The EFF were kingmakers in the recent municipal elections, and they are highly critical of the corruption in the ANC.
They do have some very unwise ideals centred on anti-white racism but they also have a large following because that isn't all they are concerned about. Scary? Yes. Because Julius and his comrades have made infamous the song "One settler, one bullet."
"One settler, one bullet."
And you don't think that sounds like a nazi? Does to me. Hope he stays well out of things. I read someone that one of his heroes is Robert Mugabe. Tells me all I need to know about that individual.
Yes, he likes Uncle Bob. But then, so does Zuma. Julius is a maverick but certainly not a nazi as he isn't a nationalist and is basically oriented toward communism. It's why the EFF wear red. We try not to think about what can go wrong as our lives here are very precarious and getting more so every day under Zuma's regime. We have to survive because we have nowhere else to go. Our ancestral homelands are far too busy kowtowing to globalisation and multiculturalism to be even vaguely interested in us. Mrs Thatcher did care, but she is gone. We are the people the post colonialists left behind.
Your comment "things can change very quickly," which you said in another thread and one that I didn't entirely agree is still ringing in my ears, LW, what with the situation in Spain and Iraq to name two places.
As long as people like Julias stay away, you'll be fine. The leaders in the "homelands" don't even care about their own people let alone anyone else. It will change, and perhaps change rather suddenly one day.
Do you know what, I don't think Mrs T has been mentioned on here until now. It's interesting how people fade from memories, even famous people.
Mrs T cooked her goose with her attitude toward the miners. She forgot they were people and she neglected the most important fact, they were her people. It's good to be a strong leader and take no crap from any quarter, but it is fatal to forget who you are and that the people are part of you when you take leadership of any political party. You aren't there just for some of them but for all of them, for the nation. Thatcher did have some sense of this at first, but it faded.
The reason why Mandela was so popular when he became President was charisma as a leader of the nation. That put South Africa on the road to recovery by allowing it to continue along the road of progress that incorporated all the nation and nations and all the classes, not just a little coterie of thieves. But Mandela was too ill and elderly to hold that position and came to it too late, so the ANC put aside his aspirations and went for the cash. Under Zuma, they have disgraced themselves beyond redemption.
The situation in Spain and Iraq? Powder keg of historical tensions. It will blow. Just because someone may put a lid on it for now, or try to crush the people who have legitimate causes doesn't mean they kill the seed of regeneration. That seed tries to germinate all over the world in many nations that have their origins in oppression and conquest. Even in places like the Americas. That seed still tries for the light, centuries later.
One way power groups can get rid of it, in their belief system, is to encourage the people who were conquered to interbreed with the conquerors. To remove their sense of identity and replace it with a new one. To make them forget their ancestors, their people and their heritage. Not to rewrite history, but to blot it out. They call this "multiculturalism" and America's liberal/left have taken this to a powerful socio-political tool in the attempt of a few to gain control over the many. It is the root of globalism, multiculturalism's bigger, uglier sister, and it's enforced today by some really mean-spirited legislation.
But even though the bigwigs might think they have finally cowed the people, things have a habit of rising from the grave of history and coming back to bite them. That is what I mean by the way things can change suddenly. All that is needed is a charismatic leader and this is why, everywhere they can, on the internet and anywhere in political movements or new ideological causes, the voices that have strength and power because they have genuine love for their people and their heritage, get squished by armies of trolls. Long ago, they hanged dissidents for treason or some trumped up charge, burned them as "witches" or tortured them into silence and by doing so, they terrorised the people into abandoning their causes and their identities.
But, like seeds after rain, the new spirits rise up from the bones of the old and the causes are brought back to life and the fallen torches are found by young people who take them up, are infused with the same spirit of justice and boom, revolution.
Perhaps, when the cash mongering, power seeking wizards of oppression who wear masks with smiles painted on them to hide the truth beneath finally realise that their mission is hopeless, they will give up the struggle to conquer the world. But it's up to the people whether this happens or not. If the people are too busy babbling on facebook or looking at cute cat pictures and weeping over targeted causes, they will be blind to their opportunities to resist the honeyed voices of the "caring" social engineers.
So, as is so often the case, the people get what the people want because the people don't realise that what they think they want is actually what their leaders want. The puppeteer tells them which way to leap and they leap, stabbing their own folk in the back in their eagerness to jerk about to the music of threats and rewards.
It's a very old story and it isn't about God, it's about us. We are our own worst enemies when it comes to believing any old narrative that comes from the mouths of self appointed prophets. We still bow to the authority of creeds, while, as D.H. Lawrence put it in his novel The Rainbow, "the stars are wheeling in freedom" above us.