Will Trump encourage the revival of Iran?

  • What complete and utter bollocks , every bloody word !

    Why you say so? What exactly is wrong about it?


    Fact is, that the british ship is in iranian hands now, with its crew. Fact is, Iran will release it, when our ship is released.


    Its also a fact, that Trump doesnt help the UK. The USA told answered UK, they advice you, your ships should avoid the area. There you have it now, Iran kicked out the UK of persian gulf waters.


    Iran wants to be taken serious. That your country treats us as equal. Deals with us as it does with France, Germany or Russia.


    We want that you change your behavior towards us and treat us with respect.


    Your crew will be treated good. This can be solved in a peaceful way. So far nobody got hurt. Im sure our countries can solve this and have better relations in the future.


    But one thing...its interesting your european friends have forsaken you. Germany, France, Spain, Italy and so on...stay silent.


    Because US sanctions, we depend on the EU alot. The EU could really hurt us. But chose to do nothing. I think thats the more important thing seen here.

  • Trump was against the Iran 'deal' even before he considered becoming President. He promised to get a more balanced deal, and has tried to keep his promises. Iran hasn't kept it's side of the bargain, so they literally invited Trumps intervention.

    Tell m please, where have we not kept our side of the bargain? :)


    The UN says Iran followed evry single step of the contract. You now make stuff up to fullfill your worldview?


    Trump wint get a new deal. we dont negotiate with USA any longer. They are not trustworthy.

  • Wow. That quote tells us absolutely nothing! It just says verification is ongoing, but not what the findings were.


    I read somewhere that Iran had exceeded the agreed nuclear material, but it was 'only by a small %'!

    I too read somewhere that the Iranians has complied with the agreement not to develop nuclear fission for military purposes and that a suspected small blip was brought to the Iranian's attention and corrected accordingly.


    The more I read about the reason for the broken deal between America and Iran, the more reason I have to conclude that it was America who acted in bad faith, partly under Obama's presidency but brought to a head under Trump's. The American side of the deal had always placed Iran on a tight leash, where the removal or easing of sanctions could always be re-invoked at the drop of a hat. What sticks in my craw - and probably Iran's - is that throughout the deal there were "invisible" sanctions emanating from America, mostly to do with scare tactics such as discouraging companies to commit to trade agreements with Iran lest these fall apart if sanctions had to be resumed because of Iran's reputation for unpredictable or untrustworthy behaviour. During this period, with America playing its customary role as self-appointed world policeman, Iran complied with the nuclear deal, give or take a small blip described at the beginning of this posted comment, which could not in itself be reasonably interpreted as a breach of agreement.


    So I would contend that Trump reneged on the deal, even though it was America who had been acting in bad faith (as described above). So there was no longer any reason for Iran to restrict its nuclear developments to peacetime domestic purposes (at least not in Iran's mind). Naturally America retaliated by re-invoking sanctions against Iran, which have become economically crippling. I can understand, even sympathise with Iran deciding they may as well be hung for a sheep as for a lamb.


    In spite of all the above I still view Iran as a rogue state, in which its commitment to The Islam Awakening makes them a forsworn ideological enemy of the West. The more Darioush seeks to insert his ten-cents worth into Iranian matters, without ever properly engaging in debate, the creepier he becomes and the more I start wondering if he is a troll or shill working for Iran.

  • For you obviously debate means 100% agreement with your side. Thats a typical idea from westerners. I can give you my debate.


    I dont want my country negotiate with USA ever again. USA is an enemy in an absolute way. They broke the deal and are untrustworthy. They are also a sinking power and can be ignored.


    The west doesnt dare war with us, so its best, that we get trade with europe running. Since europe is kinda coward, we need pressure to get europe to that point. Beside that we need russia and china on our side.


    I want respect. That we get treated with respect. Good example is UK, which treats us not with respect.


    What did UK think when they hijacked our tanker? No moatter if i support my government or not, i will always want my country to defend our interest. There was gigantic pressure from the people of Iran, that UK gets punished for its behavior. Now that a uk tanker has been taken by us, we are equal.


    We dont want, that we get treated in a bad way.

  • There is NO evidence that the UK ship rammed an Iranian fishing vessel. The UK and the EU were very lapse in not providing protection for ships in International waters. Then again, it isn't a British ship, it just carries the UK flag. Keep it and we'll keep yours.

  • There is NO evidence that the UK ship rammed an Iranian fishing vessel. The UK and the EU were very lapse in not providing protection for ships in International waters. Then again, it isn't a British ship, it just carries the UK flag. Keep it and we'll keep yours.


    Its a fact that this ship did drive on the wrong side of the strait.


    It is a british ship. It carries the british flag. According international law, you are rsponsible to protect all ships sailing under your flag.


    You had the chance to get yours back. Iran had long talks with british officials. When you announced our ship will be held for anotehr 30 days, it was time to act.

  • You are defending your country, we are defending ours. Why do you come on here? We have zero influence with our government. Your government is doing plenty to inflate tensions so why not try to influence them instead of wasting your time here?

  • Its a fact that this ship did drive on the wrong side of the strait.

    Says who?

    It is a british ship. It carries the british flag. According international law, you are rsponsible to protect all ships sailing under your flag.

    Would you be happy if we protected them? I doubt it!

    You had the chance to get yours back. Iran had long talks with british officials. When you announced our ship will be held for anotehr 30 days, it was time to act.

    Like I said ... keep it if you want to escalate tension. Iran didn't use diplomacy. It used threats and illegal actions to bully the UK.


    Now what would you like the UK to do? Capitulate to bullying tactics, by chance?

  • You are defending your country, we are defending ours. Why do you come on here? We have zero influence with our government. Your government is doing plenty to inflate tensions so why not try to influence them instead of wasting your time here?


    I love to travel. I visit Europe for my competitions and also was already in Chile, Peru and also India and Sri Lanka ad even the UK. I was in a city called Southampton. I like hear other opinion but also show how i think.

    You say why i´m here? When all this started i wanted show how i think about it.


    I think exchange is important dont you think? You hear my opinion, i hear yours. If you are only stuck with yourself. you end like North Korea.


    When UK took our ship, it felt sooo bad. It feels like a kick in the belly. Of course people are not happy then and demand an answer.


    The thing we want most is respect. We want treated like equals. And be treated with respect.


    What i want? I think best is UK and Iran negotiate. Our foreign minster said, the Uk should stop to act like a vasall of USA.


    Let our ship go and we let yours go.


    Evrything can be negotiated.


    Help us to sell our oil. Like evryone we need income. Why you think we sell oil to Syria?


    Look...we have all stuff. IPhone, Samsung, Nike Shoes, Mercedes cars and so on but evrything has to be smuggeled through Armenia, Azerbaijan, Turkey and so on. That makes the price high. This must end. And it would be better for us.

  • You don't know what your government get up to, the same as we don't know what out government get up to.


    I agree that negotiation is the best recourse, but that should have attempted before you took a ship in retaliation. Retaliation leads to more retaliation, and can lead to war. IF (and it's a big if) the UK took the Iranian ship illegally, then why didn't Iran use diplomatic means, or even mediation before taking a UK ship? C'mon .... tell me why!


    I find it very difficult to believe that the UK ship 'was on the wrong side' or that it rammed an Iranian fishing vessel.

  • You don't know what your government get up to, the same as we don't know what out government get up to.


    I agree that negotiation is the best recourse, but that should have attempted before you took a ship in retaliation. Retaliation leads to more retaliation, and can lead to war. IF (and it's a big if) the UK took the Iranian ship illegally, then why didn't Iran use diplomatic means, or even mediation before taking a UK ship? C'mon .... tell me why!


    I find it very difficult to believe that the UK ship 'was on the wrong side' or that it rammed an Iranian fishing vessel.

    You are wasting your time fidget , he listens to press TV for pitys sake!

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  • You don't know what your government get up to, the same as we don't know what out government get up to.


    I agree that negotiation is the best recourse, but that should have attempted before you took a ship in retaliation. Retaliation leads to more retaliation, and can lead to war. IF (and it's a big if) the UK took the Iranian ship illegally, then why didn't Iran use diplomatic means, or even mediation before taking a UK ship? C'mon .... tell me why!


    I find it very difficult to believe that the UK ship 'was on the wrong side' or that it rammed an Iranian fishing vessel.


    Iran tried to use diplomatic solutions for two weeks now. But nothing happened. What are we supposed to do? When the UK said they will keep our ship 30 days longer, we snapped.


    I dont want war.

  • The UK tried to use diplomatic solutions for two weeks. Nothing happened, except threats from Iran and DELIBERATELY increasing the tensions by seizure of a UK ship.


    We don't want war either, but Iran is going to encourage it if they keep breaking international laws.


    Anyway, you believe what you like. I agree with Nigel that you don't really want our opinions. You just want to press home your own opinions. Time will tell which country is the warmonger and I very much doubt it will be the UK!


    Now go try and talk some sense into your government instead of wasting your time here .... or don't you have political forums in Iran where you can vent your spleen?


  • Im thankful for your words. It shows how much your so called exchange of ideas is just words. You want boil in your own dogma and you dont have the ability to think into others.


    A core problem is, that UK breaks international law. And we feel powerless if we dont act against that.


    Remember it was UK taking our ship first. Thats the core. Now UK is in same situation. We want our ship free. Thats what matters for us and i hope the UK can give us our ship back.


    The moment our ship is free, the british ship will be free as well.


    If we release the uk ship and the UK does not release our ship, we would lose our face.

  • You ignore the queries I put to you and like a typical politician, you answer the question you wanted to be asked. DO YOU HAVE POLITICAL FORUMS IN IRAN??????? I am trying to understand why you are here, because your reasons so far have all been baloney!


    I do not like one way, one sided, discussions.

  • yes we have political forums in Iran. Like irandefense.com


    I like to talk with people from other countries. Im also in a russian forum.


    That said, you see im never agressive or rude to anyone here and find the way you talk to me not very respectful.


    I looked google for a british politic forum, when our ship was taken.

  • You see yourself as you wish to see yourself. It isn't reflected in reality. Bye now.

    You dont own reality and you are not the center of the universe. You may accept, that your point of view is not universal. In the end, the UK is a small country with little international power. Brexit shows that even more, since it reduces the UK to a mere american vasall.


    The UK lives in the illussion, that non europeans must bow to them. Iran doesnt bow. India hates you and has more international power and China laughs about you as well. Russia poisons people in your own country without consequence. See our action as medicine and accept your international status, which is like Switzerland or Italy.

  • Haha. You really take the biscuit. Iran is very welcome to you. I am certain you fit right in there.


    We live in 2019 and i guess adjusting to the new realities might not be so easy for you. The UK is not a nation with much international power.


    I think China said it as first openly and called the UK an old museum.


    There wont be any war. The risks are too high. Iran made clear it would destroy evrything around us. The desalination plants in Saudi Arabia and the Emirates, the oil infrastructure. Attack Israel and burn down the entire region.


    The UK doesnt want that and without US support, UK does nothing. USA already chickened out. All we get are empty threats.


    So what will happen? UK will release our ship. We will release the UK ship. And all is fine.


    Iran learned, that the west in general only learns from pressure. As soon we appear weak, we get exploited. We have the UK 14 days to think about its mistake. It did not learn. So now we teach a lesson in respect.

  • Two other threads on exactly the same subject merged into here, no need for multiple threads on the same subject.

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  • We live in 2019 and i guess adjusting to the new realities might not be so easy for you. The UK is not a nation with much international power.

    The UK's power is diminished, I agree, otherwise it wouldn't have been possible for the Iranian regime to seize our tanker, but we are still in the Top 5 of world powers, both military, politically and economically.

    There wont be any war. The risks are too high. Iran made clear it would destroy evrything around us. The desalination plants in Saudi Arabia and the Emirates, the oil infrastructure. Attack Israel and burn down the entire region.

    Iran won't directly attack Israel, which is why it uses its proxies (the terrorist groups) to do its bidding. Unlike Iran, Israel is a nuclear power and if Iran were foolish enough to launch a massive direct attack on Israel, then Iran would cease to exist.


    So what will happen? UK will release our ship. We will release the UK ship. And all is fine.


    Iran learned, that the west in general only learns from pressure. As soon we appear weak, we get exploited. We have the UK 14 days to think about its mistake. It did not learn. So now we teach a lesson in respect.

    All is not fine, even if both tankers are released, things have gone too far.

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  • Well , I could use hundreds of words to say nothing like you do , but life is too short .

    Excellent rejoinder! Apologies - I didn't know you knew only "hundreds" of words. As that's not many, you should know that "rejoinder" means a witty comeback. So now you can add that to your finite vocabulary.

  • 1 Debate means agreeing or disagreeing with what the other person says and if disagreeing, provide a counter argument. Your idea of debate is to ignore anything you disagree with. That's a mindless mob mentality.


    2 America opened the door to discussion, to find a solution. Your country chose to rebuff that invitation. Wouldn't you like your country to be liked and paid attention to for something more than just its oil?


    3 No country will ever be a sincere ally to a country that thinks the way you do. All you can hope for are rogue nations who can be your dear enemies, who will try and use you just as you are trying to use them They and us will buy your oil as long as it is necessary and there is no better choice. Iran is more a "good bye" than a "good buy", more a "distress" purchase. After the oil runs out or when replaced by new types of energy, you won't see us for dust (nor any other country) and you'll be on a diet of sand rissoles.


    4 You want respect. We all want that. What is there to respect about you and Iran? In answering that, try not to confuse respect & admiration with fear & apprehension. There are too many power players on this globe, with too many dangerous toys, leading to M.A.D (Mutually Assured Destruction). You might be in a better mental state if you cut down on steroids!


    5 I agree with you. The UK was stupid grabbing your tanker near Gibraltar and thinking Iran wouldn't do the same with their tanker near their coastline. I think Iran is right not to care about EU rules, regulations or points of law about sanctions. Your action was a justifiable proportional measure-for-measure retaliation. The fact that Britain is now pompously huffing & puffing would be laughable if it wasn't so embarrassing.


    6 You don't wan't to be treated in a bad way? Gee, what a surprise! What country or its people does?


    BTW: there is no significance in my sometimes saying "you" and other times saying "Iran". I regard you and Iran as interchangeable, not least because you might be a paid agent or shill for the Iranian government or theocracy or Revolutionary Guards or Thought Police or whatever. If you're none of those things and just a typical member of the Iranian public, then that means your thoughts are genuine and typical of those of the Iranian public, which is an even worse prospect.

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