Will Trump encourage the revival of Iran?

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  • Rather a silly thing to do. People will assume the worst possible scenario now.

    No they wont.


    You dont get one thing. This shot down was an accident. Most passengers were iranians from abroad. The government here doesnt expect any response from abroad., nor does it care. It doesnt try to hide from outside. It tries to hide inside. As soon you realize this, the sooner you understand.

  • If nothing to hide, then why hide it? Share the black box data. It's too late to allow Ukraine to examine the wreckage!

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • No they wont.


    You dont get one thing. This shot down was an accident. Most passengers were iranians from abroad. The government here doesnt expect any response from abroad., nor does it care. It doesnt try to hide from outside. It tries to hide inside. As soon you realize this, the sooner you understand.

    Thats OK then.... as long as someone wins the argument who gives a shite about passengers enjoying a flight being blasted to their death.

  • If nothing to hide, then why hide it? Share the black box data. It's too late to allow Ukraine to examine the wreckage!


    Amazing, you did not get a single thing i said.


    The iranian government right now does evrything to cover this up inside Iran. It gives a shit about public opinion in USA, UK or Ukraine.


    You can expect much more desinformation in next days. The iranian media will spill theory after theory into the world until nobody who is not into this topic will know whats going on. Russia is a master in this (MH17).

  • If nothing to hide, then why hide it? Share the black box data. It's too late to allow Ukraine to examine the wreckage!

    And bulldoze the crash site away

  • Secrecy and hiding/destruction of evidence creates mistrust. If Iran doesn't want to be trusted then fair enough. They won't be!

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • Secrecy and hiding/destruction of evidence creates mistrust. If Iran doesn't want to be trusted then fair enough. They won't be!

    Iran will never be trusted whilst this evil regime is running the show

  • Secrecy and hiding/destruction of evidence creates mistrust. If Iran doesn't want to be trusted then fair enough. They won't be!


    Iran gives a shit about your trust. They want hide it from our own population. I dont know what you dont understand about that?


    I believe one of the biggest problems in the west is, that they teach you your individual opinion matters and that you value for anyone. Thats not right in reality nd that the main problem you face with Iran, China, Russia and so on, who dont care about your opinion and roll over it.

  • Iran gives a shit about your trust. They want hide it from our own population. I dont know what you dont understand about that?


    I believe one of the biggest problems in the west is, that they teach you your individual opinion matters and that you value for anyone. Thats not right in reality nd that the main problem you face with Iran, China, Russia and so on, who dont care about your opinion and roll over it.

    So why do you bother posting here?

  • Iran gives a shit about your trust. They want hide it from our own population. I dont know what you dont understand about that?


    I believe one of the biggest problems in the west is, that they teach you your individual opinion matters and that you value for anyone. Thats not right in reality nd that the main problem you face with Iran, China, Russia and so on, who dont care about your opinion and roll over it.

    Deary me. Have I hit a nerve? Trust means that Iran' agreements and promises would not be subjected to lots of checks. I doubt that can be avoided now.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • Deary me. Have I hit a nerve? Trust means that Iran' agreements and promises would not be subjected to lots of checks. I doubt that can be avoided now.


    Look you say west dont trust Iran.


    Iran says it doesnt trust the west. Both is funded by facts. Since both sides dont trust each other agreements will be based on checks on both sides.

  • The point is.. members on this forum... ordinary people .. ARE saying they want trust and therefore peace will follow and countries work together. I/we dont have to accept what corup politicians say and do... we KNOW they say and do corruption and mistrust but we, ordinary people do not want their shite. THis is the point.

    I dont care how the General died... I, as a reasonably intelligent person, do not want him and his gang killing people. Thats that. Its not rocket science? or missile science, to be exact.

  • Secrecy and hiding/destruction of evidence creates mistrust. If Iran doesn't want to be trusted then fair enough. They won't be!

    They fear that if there is evidence that they shot down the plane, then the Americans might attack them, hence why they're busy bulldozing the crash site.

    If my post is in this colour, it is a moderator decision. Please abide by it.

  • Iran just admitted the accidental shotdown.


    Something that Russia and USA never did when they shot down civilian airliners.

  • Can you imagine the Promo to visit Tehran

    Flying in, we may shoot your aircraft down

    Holidaying here? We#ll probably imprison you for no real reason

    Gay? We'll hang you

  • Under UK law this would be murder. Some slight chance of a reduction to manslaughter but either way .. a life sentence is on the cards.

  • Can you imagine the Promo to visit Tehran

    Flying in, we may shoot your aircraft down

    Holidaying here? We#ll probably imprison you for no real reason

    Gay? We'll hang you

    Can you imagine the promo for london?


    Fly there, get stabbed on a bridge. Fly there and get beheaded on open street.


    This was an accident. Accidents happen.

  • Under UK law this would be murder. Some slight chance of a reduction to manslaughter but either way .. a life sentence is on the cards.

    No, under UK law it would be manslaughter. Murder follows a special description.


    And is your law different to USA? The guy who ordered to shot down a civilian airliner got a medal in USA and it took USA 20 years to apologize.


    Do you hold Iran to higher standards than USA? Thats amazing.

  • Can you imagine the promo for london?


    Fly there, get stabbed on a bridge. Fly there and get beheaded on open street.


    This was an accident. Accidents happen.

    So true, our fault for letting terrorists come here

    Same ones that roam around the Middle East killing at random, until uncle Donald gives them a present

  • No, under UK law it would be manslaughter. Murder follows a special description.


    And is your law different to USA? The guy who ordered to shot down a civilian airliner got a medal in USA and it took USA 20 years to apologize.


    Do you hold Iran to higher standards than USA? Thats amazing.

    How people in power choose to deal with an incident is NOT the same as citing the actual law. I am always speaking of the Rule of Law and abuse of same by the powerful.. I have hundreds of posts on here about it so spare me the lectures on law and international relations.

    If you want to debate the law on Murder - Homicide... you will lose because this is my subject.

    If you commit an act whereby it is easily foreseen a death will occurr and or you intend harm or to kill and if you do not intend to KILL but intend to cause harm and by your actions a person dies, this is murder under UK law because our law operates on the judgment of "THE REASONABLE PERSON".

    Example: If you fire a gun, say... you are 20 metres from the person.. and you want to HURT them, you are aiming for their LEG .. but you hit them in the HEART, they die. You are charged and can be convicted of murder because you are expected to foresee that your actions are likely to kill... hit a vital organ. The fact you "aimed for the leg" is not relevant.

    In short; a rare instance when Mens Rea does not apply.. no intention to kill but by your actions you should know death is likely. The reasonable person would agree and this is UK law.

    Hence: Iran (powers that be) ordered the missile strike.. NOT AT A PLANE (we dont know tho) but they know passenger planes fly in this vicinity (or are held to account they should know) it is not unreasonable to think a plane will be hit and since the intention of firing the missile is to HARM then they fit into the UK definition of Murder/Homicide.

    There does NOT have to be pre-meditation to commit murder.

  • Dariosh: Tell me YOUR description of the UK definition of Murder... try not to google it. I didnt google it.

  • So true, our fault for letting terrorists come here

    Same ones that roam around the Middle East killing at random, until uncle Donald gives them a present


    No, they came to UK because you colonialized them. Your ancestors raped their countries. What you get is the karma associated with it.

  • An interesting article here, and the sentence that grabbed my attention was this:


    "Others want peace at any cost yet are ignorant of what that cost might be, either now or in the future."


    I'll also repeat another sensible comment:

    “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” ― Edmund Burke.


    I wholeheartedly agree with both sentiments.


    https://independencedaily.co.u…gerous-place-update-2020/

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'


  • USA made threats against Iran at that point. Our armed forces have the order to protect our homeland.


    Our air control blocked all airspace, why the ukrainian machine took off without clearence is still under investigation. After it took off, air control contacted them and ordered them to return immedeately. The 737 recieved that order. Its flight path shows a U turn. At that moment it was already tracked by our air defense. The B737 now approached Tehran.


    There was no contact between our air traffic control and our military at that point, simply because the time frame was so narrow.


    So what do we have? A 737 in the air that should not be there and even worse it does a U turn and now approachs Tehran.


    The TOR system we use is highly automated, it tracks and only thing one must do is give free acess. This was done and so the rocket was fired.


    Now that you know the chain of events i would like to know one thing from you.


    When USA shot down the Iran Air Airbus, tehy needed 20 years to admit it. When Russia shot down MH17 they never admitted it even under such extreme high evidence. They simply say no and be done with it.


    Iran after few days openly admits it happened and explains why. Apologizes and offers compensations to victims families.


    Compared to USA and Russia behavior, what you think about the way Iran handles this?

  • I agree 100% as well.


    If peace means Iran has to bow and become a exploited colony like all ther other USA vasalls, i believe we should not strive for peace.


    The 2nd argument also fits. I dont want to live under vile USA tyranny. Our great nation is almost 3000 years old. We bow before no one.

  • Ok so you dodge the law on murder issue.

    The powerful, as we all know, by definition can circumvent consequences the rest of us have to suffer. This can be for positive outcomes i/e we all want this Iran/USA conflict to calm down and get back to normal "cold war" relations. That is best for all of us. So sometimes the literal application of law is not the best path.

    A good example is the execution of Saddam Hussein. Do you know why - under law - he was executed?? This is a fine example of the powerful using/perverting law to save face.

    The British destroyed Dresden (Germany) the war was coming to an end. There was no logical, strategic reason for bombing a major town, to nothing, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent German people. The powerful ignoring laws.

    In UK you are literally persecuted and threatened if you do not pay for your BBC TV licence ... I make no joke, this is a serious principle of law and the powerful.

  • Ok so you dodge the law on murder issue.

    The powerful, as we all know, by definition can circumvent consequences the rest of us have to suffer. This can be for positive outcomes i/e we all want this Iran/USA conflict to calm down and get back to normal "cold war" relations. That is best for all of us. So sometimes the literal application of law is not the best path.

    A good example is the execution of Saddam Hussein. Do you know why - under law - he was executed?? This is a fine example of the powerful using/perverting law to save face.

    The British destroyed Dresden (Germany) the war was coming to an end. There was no logical, strategic reason for bombing a major town, to nothing, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent German people. The powerful ignoring laws.

    In UK you are literally persecuted and threatened if you do not pay for your BBC TV licence ... I make no joke, this is a serious principle of law and the powerful.

    Would like to know if you understand the chain of events that led to this:


    USA made threats against Iran at that point. Our armed forces have the order to protect our homeland.


    Our air control blocked all airspace, why the ukrainian machine took off without clearence is still under investigation. After it took off, air control contacted them and ordered them to return immedeately. The 737 recieved that order. Its flight path shows a U turn. At that moment it was already tracked by our air defense. The B737 now approached Tehran.


    There was no contact between our air traffic control and our military at that point, simply because the time frame was so narrow.


    So what do we have? A 737 in the air that should not be there and even worse it does a U turn and now approachs Tehran.


    The TOR system we use is highly automated, it tracks and only thing one must do is give free acess. This was done and so the rocket was fired.


    Now that you know the chain of events i would like to know one thing from you.


    When USA shot down the Iran Air Airbus, tehy needed 20 years to admit it. When Russia shot down MH17 they never admitted it even under such extreme high evidence. They simply say no and be done with it.


    Iran after few days openly admits it happened and explains why. Apologizes and offers compensations to victims families.


    Compared to USA and Russia behavior, what you think about the way Iran handles this?

  • No, they came to UK because you colonialized them. Your ancestors raped their countries. What you get is the karma associated with it.

    Is that why the general murdered so many in the Middle East?

    Did their ancestors rape Iran?

    Same karma

  • Is that why the general murdered so many in the Middle East?

    Did their ancestors rape Iran?

    Same karma

    Yes, they wanted rape Iran. They wanted to conquer us many times, caused lots of suffereing to Iran. They never won.


    We know that we have to keep to pressure outside, so that our nation is save. Better kill them in Iraq, Syria ect than letting them come near our own borders.

  • Yes, they wanted rape Iran. They wanted to conquer us many times, caused lots of suffereing to Iran. They never won.


    We know that we have to keep to pressure outside, so that our nation is save. Better kill them in Iraq, Syria ect than letting them come near our own borders.

    Nice attempts at deflection but let us not forget who has recently shot down a commercial airliner, killing 176 people (Accident- Yeah!!), imprisons innocent tourists, and hangs gay people

    I have just realised that you seem to have plenty of time to post on here. Do you not have a job or are you working for the propaganda arm of the evil regime