SNP wants indyref2 at end of Brexit. What a surprise...

  • The SNP is launching its general election manifesto, which calls for an independence referendum "at the end of the Brexit process".


    The UK government has already rejected Nicola Sturgeon's call for a vote to be held in the autumn of next year or spring of 2019.


    But the SNP says that position will be "democratically unsustainable" if it wins a majority of Scottish seats.


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-s…cotland-politics-40086276
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    In one sense I do agree with Sturgeon, if the SNP get a majority of seats that does bolster their mandate for another indyref.

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  • Nicola Sturgeon has said she is to "reset" her plans for a second referendum on Scottish independence.


    The first minister had called for an independence referendum to be held in the autumn of next year or the spring of 2019.

    But she has been considering her options since the SNP lost 21 seats in the election earlier this month.

    Sturgeon calls off indy ref

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    How things can change in the space of a few weeks...


    With the loss of a swathe of her SNP MPs and the reemergence of the Conservatives, Sturgeon has wisely decided to put this issue of a 2nd indyref on ice for now.


    She know's she will get a challenge to her position from Ruth Davidson at the next Scottish election, so her thinking is on keeping her own job now, rather than her "dream" of Scottish independence.


    Is this the end of the drive of Scottish independence, or merely a pause?

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  • I think your right LW and I think the independence movement will be restarted from unexpected quarters, but I'll create another thread for that.

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  • To give a clue, who/whom has gained from the recent election? It wasn't Sturgeon or her SNP chums.

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  • Curious isn't it? They want to be independent of the rest of the UK because they don't like being ruled from London but are quite enthusiatic about subsuming most of their decision making to un-elected Eurocrats in a foreign country.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

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  • Salmond and Sturgeon have always played this carefully with the London based media, but the clue is in the fact they are Scottish nationalists. It's nothing really to do with "proper" independence, if they wanted that and they thought the majority of Scots wanted that, they could declare unilateral independence any time they wanted.


    What they are really about is being anti-English. Trawl through some of their earlier remarks in the Scottish newspapers from years gone by and you'll see they let their masks slip.


    What Salmond wanted and still wants, is to rile up the English. He wants English nationalism to explode and give him on a plate what Scots won't. And I think, although it may take time, that the seeds have been sown.


    I know my views on the Scots and Scotland have hardened over the last ten years. I am sure I am not the only one.

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  • Nicola Sturgeon has said she will be able to make a judgment on whether to hold a second referendum on Scottish independence by the end of this year.

    The first minister said her decision would be made when the shape of a deal between Britain and the European Union became clear in the autumn.

    She's back!!X/


    A new year arrived and like Farage, they all come out of the woodwork seeking attention.


    I suppose it was wishful thinking that she was going to forget about this issue as it is THE issue for her.


    I don't take Sturgeon/Salmond or the SNP lightly. If Scotland were to break off from the UK, it would be catastrophic for us and eclipse any "minor" Brexit issues that may come up.


    I don't know how Ruth Davidson and the Scottish conservatives are currently playing out in Scotland, but the SNP needs to be put back into its box.

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  • If Scotland were to break off from the UK, it would be catastrophic for us

    I have to disagree. It would be catastrophic for Scotland but we'd be better off financially plus the SNP would no longer be able to force their opinions on the rest of the UK.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

    4312-gwban-gif

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  • I know on the surface it might sound like a good idea to "get rid of the free loading Scots" or other such things that English nationalists come up with, but really it would not be.


    First of all we'd be arguing over division of assets for decades to come. Take the Czechoslovakian break up as the evidence of that and secondly it would be disastrous for our security.


    A independent (SNP) Scottish government would want to be rid of the nuclear subs and as we have no bespoke facilities for them in England, we'd have to get rid of them altogether.


    It would weaken our security around the seas, our airspace, but worst of all it would creates a land border on this island and I spoke in one of the Scottish indy threads what that could mean.


    So, although I'm tempted to agree with you Heero, I don't. I think it would be bad news and would leave us economically weaker at least for the short to medium term.

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