Ireland threatens to veto Brexit talks over Irish border

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  • The EU's chief Brexit negotiator has denied Arlene Foster's claims that he has been "aggressive" towards Northern Ireland unionists in the Brexit talks.

    It comes after the DUP leader said Michel Barnier did not understand the dispute and was not an "honest broker".

    I can't find the story about Barnier's comments this morning, so I'll just link this other story for now.

    Just as we got a new home secretary, Barnier was making a speech in Ireland and it wasn't good...

    I only saw part of the speech, but basically he said the UK's proposals for the Irish border are unsatisfyingly and he doesn't agree with them. The British government has hinted that electronic means will be used to "police" the border, but has stated its policy og having no hard border which could jeopardise the peace process.

    The UK is damned if it does and damned if it doesn't.X/

    Barner has previously said that the EU must have a proper border with non-EU countries and the Irish government has fully supported that while on the other hand saying they will never tolerate a hard border in Ireland.

    Perhaps this just another negotiating tactic by Barnier, but could the Irish problem derail Brexit?

  • Switzerland, which is NOT in the EU, does not have a 'hard' border. They use electronic checks (available 7 days per week) and run random checks, but not on the border. The checks can occur anywhere, and are often carried out miles from the border.

    The EU don't want a solution. They are trying to force the UK, or part of it, to remain in the Customs Union.

    From the Independent - a pro-EU rag

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • I would go further than that Fidget, and say that the EU don't want us to leave the EU at all. Of course if we stay in the Customs unions, we'd have to accept EU law etc etc, so would not in affect really ever leave the EU.

    Negotiations restart on the future relationship in a few weeks, so we should get a "feeler" how this will go.

  • I would go further than that Fidget, and say that the EU don't want us to leave the EU at all. Of course if we stay in the Customs unions, we'd have to accept EU law etc etc, so would not in affect really ever leave the EU.

    Negotiations restart on the future relationship in a few weeks, so we should get a "feeler" how this will go.

    Agreed. They won't admit it, but they are scared silly by Brexit. As usual they resort to bullying and blackmail which just hardens my resolve. I would leave the EU without a deal, if ever I got to vote on it. The EU are not honourable or trustworthy. I'd rather bite the bullet and suffer the short term pain. I have no doubt whatsoever that we will reap long term gain. God knows what the future of the EU is, but going by the past, it will become more controlling and dictatorial.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • Switzerland, which is NOT in the EU, does not have a 'hard' border. They use electronic checks (available 7 days per week) and run random checks, but not on the border. The checks can occur anywhere, and are often carried out miles from the border.

    The EU don't want a solution. They are trying to force the UK, or part of it, to remain in the Customs Union.

    From the Independent - a pro-EU rag

    This appears to be the solution from Reese-Mogg's group on how to deal with the border problem:

    A hard border on the island of Ireland can be avoided by using "established" technology and "modifying" existing arrangements, Brexiteer Tory MPs say.

    The European Research Group called for streamlined customs checks and closer working between Belfast and Dublin to allay compliance and smuggling fears.

    The Democratic Unionist Party welcomed the "positive and timely" report but Sinn Fein said it was "pure fantasy".

    If this all sounds familiar to you, it is, because it was David Davis' idea on how to solve the border problem before he got sidelined by May's own plans.

    It seems perfectly workable to do "border" checks at the point of origins of goods on the island of Ireland and even David Trimble was with Reese-Mogg today and was enthusiastic about this too.

    Will the Irish government accept this, will ours...?

  • No chance. The EU are playing for keeps, ie. keeping the UK under EU control. It's time that our politicians stopped playing along with them, and respected the referendum which THEY voted for!

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • This border issue really has been the thing to bully us over. The peace process is important, but so is Brexit. It's about time all the politicians stopped playing games.

    These proposals by Team Mogg are exactly what you posted about Fidget, in that the Swiss already organise their border with the EU in this way. But as I said in another thread, the Swiss also have to accept free movement...

  • Who has actually said Ireland will spill over into violence again ? , why would a border initiate this?

    There is a border already. Ireland and Northern Ireland are separated by a border, and things like VAT, tax and everything else are managed without customs posts and have been since before the EU came into existence. Checkpoints were only introduced because of the trouble between them.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • There is a border already. Ireland and Northern Ireland are separated by a border, and things like VAT, tax and everything else are managed without customs posts and have been since before the EU came into existence. Checkpoints were only introduced because of the trouble between them.

    Good post Fidget.

    The Border will always continue between Northern and Southern Ireland. I see no reason why the necessary customs checks should not continue to take place there.. The United Kingdom is a complete entity with Northern Ireland being an important part of the UK therefore trade should have no barriers between all of the UK..

    Southern Ireland is a foreign country aligned to Germany and France through the EU. We have a customs border arrangement with those two EU countries, why should Southern Ireland be any different?.

    The Voice of Reason

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