Boris promises Buy British policy and State Aid

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  • Would a Nissan car count as British if its made here, but using Japanese practices?

    I think it would be determined by how much content of the vehicle is UK sourced. I see many Japanese practices in the companies I contract for: Things such as Kaisan (continuous improvement) Kanban ( a box system for components) JIT: Just in time. No stores as things arrive just when they're needed. Cellular manufacture: Where specific "cells" are established one for each product to be made with its own stock, solder and test systems. The teams move from cell to cell as the orders come in to be made. The thing that really strikes you is how empty of people the factory seems to be yet the companies turn over £millions


    This does not make the product any less British but does improve reliability and quality as does the full involvement of the production workers in the improvement of the way things are done.


    The Japanese "attention to detail" is legendary.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

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  • I think if companies buy chicken abroad and make pies in the UK from it, those pies count as "British Made"

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • A bit like our food chain, sourcing parts is generally global in nature. So, I guess if its made here, we can probably get away with sticking a Made in Britain badge on it.

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  • Nissan is a Japanese company that has strategically set up in the UK. It employs British and EU labour because that is what is available locally and was part of the deal to set up in the UK in the first place. However they could set up anywhere and produce their cars. They are like a flea on a dog they are not part of the dog just riding on it...for the moment. They are Japanese cars made in the UK. The profits go to the mothership. Our benefit from this is employment in an otherwise depressed area and the boost to the economy and subsidiary automotive supply chain. This is what depresses me about foreign investment it has no roots. This is why we should have our own British manufacturing and a buy British policy.

  • Nissan is a Japanese company that has strategically set up in the UK. It employs British and EU labour because that is what is available locally and was part of the deal to set up in the UK in the first place. However they could set up anywhere and produce their cars. They are like a flea on a dog they are not part of the dog just riding on it...for the moment. They are Japanese cars made in the UK. The profits go to the mothership. Our benefit from this is employment in an otherwise depressed area and the boost to the economy and subsidiary automotive supply chain. This is what depresses me about foreign investment it has no roots. This is why we should have our own British manufacturing and a buy British policy.

    If only we could

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Nissan is a Japanese company that has strategically set up in the UK. It employs British and EU labour because that is what is available locally and was part of the deal to set up in the UK in the first place. However they could set up anywhere and produce their cars. They are like a flea on a dog they are not part of the dog just riding on it...for the moment. They are Japanese cars made in the UK. The profits go to the mothership. Our benefit from this is employment in an otherwise depressed area and the boost to the economy and subsidiary automotive supply chain. This is what depresses me about foreign investment it has no roots. This is why we should have our own British manufacturing and a buy British policy.

    I agree with your assessment and with the first half of your recommendation in the last sentence


    But how do we make the first half of your sentence come true and how do we maintain a competitive standard against global competition when a Buy British policy encourages the soft option of adequacy for a home market.

  • I agree with your assessment and with the first half of your recommendation in the last sentence


    But how do we make the first half of your sentence come true and how do we maintain a competitive standard against global competition when a Buy British policy encourages the soft option of adequacy for a home market.

    The only things we seem able to provide that are good are financial services

    Manufacturing has never been good in volume production, very small stuff is ok but not sufficient to enhance our economy

    It is a pity, for instance there is a small company down here that very effectively turns plastic waste into breeze blocks for buildings. Seems like a win win situation so why is this not taken up big time

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • I agree with your assessment and with the first half of your recommendation in the last sentence


    But how do we make the first half of your sentence come true and how do we maintain a competitive standard against global competition when a Buy British policy encourages the soft option of adequacy for a home market.

    First design good products

    Second manufacture them to a high quality

    Third sell them at a price that people are prepared to pay


    As a nation we need to decide we are going to back our manufacturing by getting off its back and letting it get on with it. We need to incentivise research and development of new technologies and then provide the means to allow for profitable manufacture to remain in the country. The problem starts with a lack of national policy for manufacture and the reliance on local government and authorities to nurture industry as they see fit. When this is combined with regional targets for pollution, traffic, environmental performance, air quality, increasing burdens on local tax payers due to government cuts, the influx of migrants to areas draining resources, increasing green initiatives and the local authority planning processes and local taxes waiting to screw every last penny out of any mildly successful business and of course the holy trinity of H&S legislation, Employment Law and Environmental Law and the conditions for starting manufacturing in the UK are not encouraging. The start up costs for a medium to large scale operation are eye watering and a tremendous financial risk.


    In short manufacturing needs to be encouraged by a national view that we will not take anything out of it for a few years. Be that in the form of no/low business rates, tax free periods, friendly planning authorities, and other incentives to remove the blockers. Some may call that state aid but we can set our tax as we see fit once out of the EU. Our EU friends in France have been subsidising their motor industry for years, its an open secret.


    We also need to keep regulators on a tighter leash with a revised remit to advise on improvements rather than prosecute non-compliances as they do at the moment. It will be their role to enable not to hinder. We currently have an entire industrial complex of fanatical nutters (regulators) in this country that want to comply with the most onerous over-interpretation of a regulation and then drag the whole business through the courts. We need a clear out in our enforcement agencies basically, they are all full of extremists.


    These steps should clear the path for the re-spawning of British Industry in all manner of markets. We already have great people, don't let the politicians make you think otherwise. We just need a reasonable set of conditions to allow us to thrive.

  • I don't agree, there are endless initiatives to encourage entrepreneurs to start a new business, and plenty do

    The problem seems to come from trying to grow that business, I suspect that bankers are not prepared to lend to expand

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • I know from personal experience that most of the 'initiatives' are money making schemes for 'consultants' and the like. The majority are a waste of taxpayers money. The best thing they could do for small business is to give FREE help with compliance, for example with help and guidance over legal requirements for web pages, data protection, accounting, VAT, employment specialists, export specialists, etc.


    Instead they get something like £10K to hire somebody to do something that could be obtained for £1K, or similar. Naturally, the 'consultant' or 'specialist' who benefits from these initiatives is laughing all the way to the bank. I've had the Chamber of Commerce trying to get me to engage in these schemes as a consultant and get my clients signed up, but I couldn't rip off anyone to make a cheap buck. Not even the anonymous taxpayer.

    Mark Twain — 'Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.'

  • I don't agree, there are endless initiatives to encourage entrepreneurs to start a new business, and plenty do

    The problem seems to come from trying to grow that business, I suspect that bankers are not prepared to lend to expand

    The initiatives are all about small businesses, they are all well and good but we need to restore our heavy industries and that is what I was talking about, especially with my references to over zealous regulators and fussy local authorities looking after affairs. I hardly see any current local authority sanctioning the planning permission for a new steel works or chemical plant if they can possibly find a way to say no. And this is what is missing from our industrial portfolio, the large scale heavy industries all got shipped to the Far East to circumvent all the laws we proudly put place to protect the environment and workers rights, what a grand job we did, new rules and rights to cover jobs that have disappeared as a direct result.


    Our ideologically driven politicians refuse to help out when these industries get into trouble so they disappear. Nobody ever seems to investigate the underlying reasons for the problems the businesses had. For example the steel works all started to suffer when Labour passed into law the green tax levy on energy costs not giving a stuff that it impacted the operating costs of the steel mills and other large industries quite badly. I wonder if the Chinese make their steel mills pay for electricity or is just state provided? Whilst I do not advocate for Chinese style health and safety and environmental standards nor do I advocate for virtue signalling f***wit politicians trying to do what they perceive as the right thing without a thought for the obvious implications.


    So what I mean by a new industrial revolution sparked by friendly government policy is not covered by the current initiatives for entrepreneurship.


    As for bankers, it’s all very well borrowing money but if the greater portion of that turns into tax revenues rather than investment into the business it is hardly surprising that businesses don’t get started and bankers won’t lend. Who in their right mind would take out a loan to pay a tax bill they could avoid by not taking out the loan.

  • Sorry, my question was largely rhetorical. I don't think Govt can enforce Buy British. Nor should it. But is does need to help and incentivise British manufacturing businesses to become more competitive, not merely when selling at home but more so when exporting abroad. Tax breaks on R&D for example, tied in with funding in universities and science parks. I think there should be tax concessions for companies that will take a long term view on waiting for their investment in manufacturing to deliver earnings. Investor short-term-ism is a plague on British enterprise. Banks are the kind of investor that a enterprising company needs like a hole in the head.


    I'm just so fed up with politicians' labels, shallow glib promises and slogans. I hoped Boris was going to be the kind of guy who could and would inject substance into such an important aspect of a future enterprising Britain. Maybe once he gets into number 10 with a good majority he will stop mumbling, stuttering, sloganising and ingratiating himself to every moronic voter and every hostile sensation-seeking Champagne Socialist media interviewer. Britain needs to punch above its weight across a wider sphere. And when we invent and patent something very clever, technically advanced and money-making, it seems criminally pathetic to just sell it to another country to profit from turning it into a reality. We need to monetize what those cleaver clogs are doing in universities

  • Sorry, my question was largely rhetorical. I don't think Govt can enforce Buy British. Nor should it. But is does need to help and incentivise British manufacturing businesses to become more competitive, not merely when selling at home but more so when exporting abroad. Tax breaks on R&D for example, tied in with funding in universities and science parks. I think there should be tax concessions for companies that will take a long term view on waiting for their investment in manufacturing to deliver earnings. Investor short-term-ism is a plague on British enterprise. Banks are the kind of investor that a enterprising company needs like a hole in the head.


    I'm just so fed up with politicians' labels, shallow glib promises and slogans. I hoped Boris was going to be the kind of guy who could and would inject substance into such an important aspect of a future enterprising Britain. Maybe once he gets into number 10 with a good majority he will stop mumbling, stuttering, sloganising and ingratiating himself to every moronic voter and every hostile sensation-seeking Champagne Socialist media interviewer. Britain needs to punch above its weight across a wider sphere. And when we invent and patent something very clever, technically advanced and money-making, it seems criminally pathetic to just sell it to another country to profit from turning it into a reality. We need to monetize what those cleaver clogs are doing in universities

    I agree with the much more eloquent way you have made your points. I will respond to you when I have more time...


    ...off to work for now ?

  • From small businesses big business grows, if the finance is available to do so

    Ironically the only place such funds are available now is from the EU development fund, soon to be no longer available if we leave the EU

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Sorry, my question was largely rhetorical. I don't think Govt can enforce Buy British. Nor should it. But is does need to help and incentivise British manufacturing businesses to become more competitive, not merely when selling at home but more so when exporting abroad. Tax breaks on R&D for example, tied in with funding in universities and science parks. I think there should be tax concessions for companies that will take a long term view on waiting for their investment in manufacturing to deliver earnings. Investor short-term-ism is a plague on British enterprise. Banks are the kind of investor that a enterprising company needs like a hole in the head.


    I'm just so fed up with politicians' labels, shallow glib promises and slogans. I hoped Boris was going to be the kind of guy who could and would inject substance into such an important aspect of a future enterprising Britain. Maybe once he gets into number 10 with a good majority he will stop mumbling, stuttering, sloganising and ingratiating himself to every moronic voter and every hostile sensation-seeking Champagne Socialist media interviewer. Britain needs to punch above its weight across a wider sphere. And when we invent and patent something very clever, technically advanced and money-making, it seems criminally pathetic to just sell it to another country to profit from turning it into a reality. We need to monetize what those cleaver clogs are doing in universities

    I agree that anyone should be free to buy from who ever they want, the best product at the best price etc....


    However, there should be compelling reasons which are published by the purchaser as to why they are not buying British so we can understand why not and address the issues. Perhaps they should be required to have a “why we don’t buy British” page on their websites so they are self shaming. Then their customers can decide if they agree by taking their custom elsewhere if they see fit. A lot of overseas purchases are zip to do with quality but are accountant decisions based purely on cost or service backup or bribes. It has always been wrong for a major contract to go overseas so that one company can save a few quid at the expense of 5000 UK jobs, even more unforgivable when the government does it. As for government or major infrastructure purchases these should by legal default be British product every time unless it is a proprietary item only available from overseas.


    I completely agree with you about short termism and the toxic attitude of banks to risk which has been driven by their previously over liberal lending patterns of the past. The incentives businesses need are certainty and stability and the government needs to see the businesses as a long term investment that needs to be well nurtured to let it establish itself and mature before they take anything out. The businesses themselves need to be managed by people who are not trying to make a quick buck for themselves but will run with the script and do the right things. Obviously this is much bigger than poxy entrepreneur incentives, this is all about long term strategy to be world beaters in all the major heavy industries. A tall order but possible with the right sorts leading the way.


    We have let the Chinese take a massive lead here by letting them cheat whilst we played by our own rules and not theirs. We let our accountants put UK workers out of jobs because a cheaper Chinese product was available, why was the Chinese product cheaper? The accountants don’t ask that question they don’t care. Well they need to be brought to book in future, our jobs and our economy are more important than anyone else’s.


    Finally the politicians need to work with the country and for the country and not as part of some neo liberal globalist cartel as they do at the moment. If our politicians are not focussed on wringing improvements out of every corner of the UK we should be demanding to know why. A strong economy creates great tax revenues because everyone is productive making great product and selling to a keen market at the right price.


    Clearly some will cry we don’t have the skills and we need immigrants to fill the skills gap. Well maybe in the short term we may need some but in the long term we train our own workforce in every aspect. There will be an initial batch of deadweights who we cannot do anything with as they are already beyond salvation or training but I guess every nation has this problem but soon people will wake up to the real prosperity and opportunity that is available in the UK.


    As an aside, and I have never understood this, why do foreign workers have the skills we need but no jobs in their own country (how or why would you train in something for which there are no job opportunities) and how come we have established businesses without having the skills needed? It just doesn’t square with me. Is this another case of accountant double speak to save labour costs?