UK/EU future deal. Should the UK accept a level playing field?

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  • Now that Brexit will happen (hopefully!), we're finally onto the real deal, the free trade agreement. This thread is the successor to Will Boris get Brexit done?.


    In summary, most trade agreements between countries involve some form of alignment between countries' standards to enable trade to be done. In our case, the UK is already fully aligned with EU standards and the negotiations ahead are about how much the UK diverges from the EU after Brexit.


    The European Commission has been briefing euro countries over the last few days on what they call the "level playing field," which will become the big row between the UK and EU this year. The EU fears that the UK could become like Singapore with lower taxes and standards and attract businesses away from EU countries. They have stated that if the UK wants full access to EU markets, then we must maintain the same standards as the EU today, but also that we align ourselves to future EU standards too. Something Boris has already ruled out.


    If we agree to accept future EU law and standards, that is not leaving. Isn't Brexit meant to be about leaving the EU?

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  • A deal or agreement requires all parties to agree

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Yes and your point is?

    We can propose or offer whatever we want

    An exclusive club that we have chosen to walk out of is unlikely to concede to our demands

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • I voted OUT NO DEAL so did all leave voters. The fact we did not have a PM with integrity and a large number of MPS against democracy and an MSM, Especially the state speaker - The BBC - totally biased in favour of remain is disgraceful but it is good to see the British grit win in the end.

    I find it bizarre we have people, individuals who argue black is white and up is down and have no conscience when trying to argue such perverse logic. Example; "I want democracy, so I want to ignore the referendum result"!!!! Crazy.

  • Here's a titbit of news/rumour from that awful Brexit show on BBC1 last night, it's believed that Michael Gove will head the UK's negotiations on the free trade agreement.

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  • A level playing field is what has got the EU stuck in a rut without a chance of moving forwards. We should exploit any advantage of leaving wherever we can. If that means trading with the EU on WTO terms then so be it. We'll still be trading but without being hogtied.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

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  • Excellent BBC article on how these negotiations might play out:


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  • A level playing field is what has got the EU stuck in a rut without a chance of moving forwards. We should exploit any advantage of leaving wherever we can. If that means trading with the EU on WTO terms then so be it. We'll still be trading but without being hogtied.

    Well, we know what happened under May, total capitulation, so the EU may expect the same this time around. Lets see what happens, but as the article I just linked to explains, the EU expects us to align with many of their future laws and there's the "small" matter of fish too. If our waters aren't fully open to them, then it will be no trade deal, according to them.


    If it is Gove doing the negotiations, he will be tough and being a Scot, will be very cautious on giving away all our fishing rights.

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  • :"Britain will one day rejoin the European Union, one of the bloc's senior figures has predicted. Guy Verhofstadt, chairman of the EU's Brexit Steering Group, said he agreed with the assessment of a British MEP that Brexit will be reversed.

    Labour's Seb Dance argued the UK was taking a \"sabbatical\" from the bloc and would be back in the future. Mr Verhofstadt told BBC Radio 4's Today programme: \"I think that will happen, yes, (but) it's difficult to say when. \"There will be a generation, the young generation coming in the coming decades, who will say later, 'We want to go back'. \"It will happen. Maybe you will not see it in my life, but it will happen


    https://news.sky.com/story/eus…d-it-will-happen-11910596


    And what it will cost as our future generations crawl back on bended knee begging to rejoin

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out


  • From the link


    "The Food and Drink Federation said it sounded like the "death knell" for frictionless trade with the EU and was likely to cause food prices to rise."


    Food prices to rise, is this the Shangrila promised by the Brexiteers?

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Only EU food to get a price rise and only then if we imposed tariffs, food from the rest of the world will be cheaper.


    A continuance of project fear bullshit.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

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  • Only EU food to get a price rise and only then if we imposed tariffs, food from the rest of the world will be cheaper.


    A continuance of project fear bullshit.

    You can't say you weren't warned

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Great, we can then be more self sufficient and eat what is in season. can't wait

    Nice of you can afford it

    Do you shop?

    If do you might have noticed the recent price increase in vegetables. Potatoes for instance - a bag of Estima that used to be £1 has suddenly jumped to £1.25. Brexit effect or greedy growers or shops jumping on the bandwagon

    Such an increase maybe nothing if you can afford it but to a poorer family and pensioners these staple diet increases will be a problem

    It's all very well for the likes of Farage, Rees Smug,Cash, IDS, and all the others who will make a packet out of Brexit

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Reading some of the comments on here it seems that nothing has changed with regard to the divisions within the country. Remainers predict disaster and Brexiters still believe in rainbows and unicorns.


    From where I sit, nothing is certain at this time. We are in a completely unique situation. Nobody has ever left the EU before so there is no precedent to go by.


    We can say anything we like and claim this or that will happen one way or another, but nobody knows for sure.


    A lot of remainers are going to be pretty red faced if all the things they predicted don't happen.... if the traffic flows in and out of Dover with no trouble.... if the supply of medicine isn't affected.... if the American Big Pharma and health insurance interests don't take over the NHS...... If those things really were "project fear", then the Brexiters are going to be very quick to point that out.


    Time is the only thing that will tell.


    Let the Brexiters have their party on 31 January. They've been waiting for it long enough. The remainers can stay in for the night and watch a good film on the telly. For my money, that's much better than going out in the cold. Perhaps some church bells will ring, perhaps some won't. Will it really matter..?


    I'm just going to sit back and watch over the next 11 months. What else can any of us do..? We can shout and rant and get all hot under the collar about Brexit, but it's going to get over the finishing line now and that's the only fact we do know.


    Well..... not the only fact...... Once Brexit HAS happened, the Tory party is going to have to own it. For good or bad, it's their baby and if (and I emphasise the "if") things do go mammaries aloft, they're going to have to carry the can. They and they alone. There is only one rosette pinned to Brexit and it's a big blue one.


    It's nobody's baby but theirs. They started it, they wanted it, they made it happen. They made all the promises, they told us we would live in a land of milk and honey. They told us the EU needs us more than we need them and they will cave in as soon as we start to play hardball with them.


    Saying all these things is fine when the only people you have to convince is a British public that will believe anything they're told when it's what they want to hear.


    Dealing with Brussels.... who have a very genuine interest in not making it easy for Britain, and are prepared to take a financial hit to protect the integrity of the Single Market.... will be beyond the power of Dominic Cummings machinations and three-word catch phrases to influence.


    Do they REALLY need us more than we need them...? Will they REALLY cave in if we threaten sales of VW's and Prosecco..?


    As I said... time will tell.


    It's going to be a fascinating eleven months.

  • Reading some of the comments on here it seems that nothing has changed with regard to the divisions within the country. Remainers predict disaster and Brexiters still believe in rainbows and unicorns.

    What you say is true but there are signs and indicators

    Look at the businesses that are failing, they blame Brexit, no problem if it's not you losing your job

    Mentioned elsewhere, food prices going up, ok if you can afford it

    Scotland and the effect on the Union

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • What you say is true but there are signs and indicators

    Look at the businesses that are failing, they blame Brexit, no problem if it's not you losing your job

    Mentioned elsewhere, food prices going up, ok if you can afford it

    Scotland and the effect on the Union

    Shhhhhhhhh..... don't mention Scotland.... You'll bring Casablanca out from in front of his mirror where he's probably admiring himself.


    I don't go much on signs and indicators. They tend to get things wrong, like predicting a Remain win in 2016, which may possibly have meant a lot of people who would have voted remain didn't come out to vote because they thought they didn't need to. But heck, that's speculation on my part and water under the bridge now.


    All the same, signs and indicators can be fickle.


    I prefer to wait and see.

  • Nice of you can afford it

    Do you shop?

    If do you might have noticed the recent price increase in vegetables. Potatoes for instance - a bag of Estima that used to be £1 has suddenly jumped to £1.25. Brexit effect or greedy growers or shops jumping on the bandwagon

    Such an increase maybe nothing if you can afford it but to a poorer family and pensioners these staple diet increases will be a problem

    It's all very well for the likes of Farage, Rees Smug,Cash, IDS, and all the others who will make a packet out of Brexit

    Food prices go up and down naturally, and the seasonal nature of food contributes to that. It is nothing to do with Brexit, the impact of which will not hit until 2021.


    I don't buy the price rise scare. It is not only the EU we will trade with in the future - we can get our food from elsewhere.


    If the EU impose tariffs (which they have said they don't want to do), we will just impose tariffs back. Who do you think will benefit from that?

  • We can propose or offer whatever we want

    An exclusive club that we have chosen to walk out of is unlikely to concede to our demands

    If they can do it for Canada, they can do it for the UK.


    People have got to get out of this fixation that we will still be half in the EU when we leave.

  • He's one of many who seems to have an almost religious attachment to the failing EU.


    We will never go back, at least while the EU remains the monolithic bureaucratic structure it is, and because I believe it will eventually collapse in on itself, there would be no future opportunity to rejoin anyway, even if we wanted to.


    In any case, when the younger generation grow older, they will see the real benefits of Brexit and wonder how they could have been taken in by all the remainer propoganda in their tender years.


    Look back and laugh out loud!

  • I admire your optimism

    However the signs are already there to show what a disaster we are rushing into

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Food prices go up and down naturally, and the seasonal nature of food contributes to that. It is nothing to do with Brexit, the impact of which will not hit until 2021.


    I don't buy the price rise scare. It is not only the EU we will trade with in the future - we can get our food from elsewhere.


    If the EU impose tariffs (which they have said they don't want to do), we will just impose tariffs back. Who do you think will benefit from that?

    Where elsewhere are we going to get our food from?

    Flying in from S America?

    Food is no longer seasonal whilst we have supplies from the EU

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Why do you think we won't still be importing food from the EU?


    We'll also still be importing food from non-EU countries as we do now.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

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  • Why do you think we won't still be importing food from the EU?


    We'll also still be importing food from non-EU countries as we do now.

    Tariffs

    The EU is not going to fall over itself to accommodate the UK

    Look at the latest proposal from us

    "Boris Johnson unveils strict limits on unskilled migrants "


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/po…imits-unskilled-migrants/


    Hardly likely to endear us to the EU

    And the rub is that we desperately need these workers, farmers, care home owners, menial jobs - all for jobs that British workers will not do

    All this to pursue some dogma

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out

  • Tariffs don't stop imports or exports.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

    4312-gwban-gif

    If my post is in this colour  it is moderation. Take note.

  • I admire your optimism

    However the signs are already there to show what a disaster we are rushing into

    I don't think so, bryanluc. Just take the example of tariffs. We keep hearing from the ardent remainers that the EU will impose tariffs on us if we leave. But says who? The political declaration clearly states that an important objective - supported by both sides - will be a non-tariff agreement.


    Here's why the EU does not like the idea of tariffs being applied. The EU exports more to us than we do to them.


    In 2018, UK exports to the EU were £291 billion. UK imports from the EU were £357 billion.


    So, if the EU slapped tariffs on us, we could simply slap them on EU exports to Britain. That means the UK makes a profit and the EU has to find the money to make up the difference.


    Brexit is only a disaster in the minds of those who don't possess the imagination to understand the wonderful opportunities that lie ahead or are financially dependent in some way through our membership of the EU.


    The rest of us have nothing to worry about.

  • It is not dogma. It's all about freeing ourselves from the shackles of the EU.


    As for tariffs, I have explained elsewhere today that the EU is not in favour of tariffs restricting trade with the UK. That will hurt them in the pocket more than us.

  • Where elsewhere are we going to get our food from?

    Flying in from S America?

    Food is no longer seasonal whilst we have supplies from the EU

    You are joking, right? The rest of the world is a darn sight bigger than the EU!

  • Tariffs don't stop imports or exports.

    True, unless they make the price prohibitive

    You can see the price of food creeping up already,potatoes for instance

    A Hand Up Not A Hand Out