New Chinese virus spreads

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  • Oh, dear. New Zealand going for another lockdown. How many times does this have to happen before governments get the message that lockdowns will not rid them of this virus?

    The lockdown did get rid of the virus. The problem is they opened the borders afterwards and someone has then gone and brought it back in. So it's not that lockdowns don't work, the problem is people travelling around the world. If every county in the world was to strictly close all borders I reckon the whole world could get better control of this virus. Right now it's free to roam around where it wants which of course is another option. Allow it to roam around and do what it likes until it burns out and accept the consequences which means killing off many people and lots more stress and strain on health services now and in the future. Many folk who recover from a serious case end up with lifelong damage to organs including brain damage in some cases. So it's a case of either paying for it now in one lump sum and getting it over and done with or pay for it in bits and drabs that add up to larger amount over a longer period of time. There is no such thing as save the economy as we end up paying for it in one way or the other.

  • I would go along with sensible measures to isolate festering hotspots, but I think we should generally avoid future lockdowns, except for the vulnerable amongst us.

    The working population need to get back out there, because the alternative is worse.

    But as we have seen with all the crowded beaches and pubs, masses of people either do not care about the virus spreading or are ignorant about its dangers to elderly and vulnerable people. Those same people will eventually come into contact with an elderly grandparent and spread the virus to them. We either have complete lockdown or not, I don't see how the government's new idea of letting under 40s do want they want while protecting the over 60s will work. And what happens to those between 40 and 60, like me?

  • The lockdown did get rid of the virus.

    Which shows lockdown works and if streets have to be policed with armed troops to enforce another lockdown, so be it.


    The problem is they opened the borders afterwards and someone has then gone and brought it back in

    In this country, our borders were never closed. People could still fly in on planes and hundreds of lorries were coming through our ports each day.

    If our borders were totally shut down and if the rest of the world did the same, it would kill the spread of the virus, I agree. It's in part due to globalisation that has made this pandemic much worser than it need be.


    Many folk who recover from a serious case end up with lifelong damage to organs including brain damage in some cases. So it's a case of either paying for it now in one lump sum and getting it over and done with or pay for it in bits and drabs that add up to larger amount over a longer period of time. There is no such thing as save the economy as we end up paying for it in one way or the other.

    Exactly. This needs to be dealt with now and the whole world is in the same boat as us.

  • Oh, dear. New Zealand going for another lockdown. How many times does this have to happen before governments get the message that lockdowns will not rid them of this virus?

    I know this is the majority view here, but as the NZ experience showed, lockdown and closing borders did work and it was only when they reopened borders, as mentioned earlier in this thread, that they've got this problem again.

    The whole world needs to go into lockdown, not at different times, but all at exactly the same time.

  • But as we have seen with all the crowded beaches and pubs, masses of people either do not care about the virus spreading or are ignorant about its dangers to elderly and vulnerable people. Those same people will eventually come into contact with an elderly grandparent and spread the virus to them. We either have complete lockdown or not, I don't see how the government's new idea of letting under 40s do want they want while protecting the over 60s will work. And what happens to those between 40 and 60, like me?

    So we go into a complete lock down with 90% of the population having no immunity to the virus. Guess what, when we come out of the lock down we still have 90% of the population without any immunity. Lock downs just delay the inevitable, and nothing more.

    The intelligent are being oppressed so the stupid don't get offended

  • I know this is the majority view here, but as the NZ experience showed, lockdown and closing borders did work and it was only when they reopened borders, as mentioned earlier in this thread, that they've got this problem again.

    The whole world needs to go into lockdown, not at different times, but all at exactly the same time.

    It won't work, Horizon, and people won't stand for it anyway.

    Good luck with getting every country to agree to a co-ordinated lockdown!

    I wonder what our Kim would demand in return for his co-operation, which he would then snatch and do something completely different?

  • That's another misconception. There is no evidence that immunity works and even it does for how long. The reality is that it's going to be an ongoing problem for many years because it's impossible for the world to come to an agreement and every country do the same thing. The simple thing to do would be to close our borders properly and that includes stopping the illegal immigrants coming across. There should be nobody leaving accept for one way tickets and nobody coming in no matter what apart from the essential cargo planes.

    We have the advantage that we are an Island so lets make use of it. If it means that airlines go bust then so be it. If means that 1000's of workers in the airports and airlines lose their jobs then so be it. They can join everyone else that has lost their job. We can't have one rule for one and different rule for another. Maybe once this is all over the airlines can build their business back up. The f***ing environment will benefit from it too. But oh no they would rather people go on holiday and then self quarantine and of course they wont so they want neighbours to then grass on their neighbours and create even more divide, hatred and fighting amongst individuals.

    And as for all the people losing their jobs the government are going to have to come up with a universal credit type system not like the benefit system they have now, a serious one which folk can afford to survive on comfortably. It's going to happen sooner or later anyway because of automation. It's either they pay folk to not work or their kill them off so they don't have to pay them, which is most likely what they are trying do in backwards kind of way. Maybe that's what COVID is all about. We're officially in a recession now.

    The gov are not stupid they know automation, robotics and computers etc are taking jobs away so many will end up without a job anyway. The high streets are dead. It wont be long before there is self driving vehicles or drones doing deliveries. Drones can be controlled by software and GPS. The same will happen with trains and buses. All self automated. Even the medical industry is becoming automated. We're seeing tasters of it it now with online medical assessments. How long before drug stores turn into a hole in the wall vending machine. Pubs may end up like that. No bar staff, just a bunch of vending machines with facial recognition to get you ID (age) and a bunch of tables. Hospital theatres are half robotic already, doctors don't want to see patients and it's done online. Remove the doctor and replace with an app, a virtual doctor. Google just needs to collect more data from FitBit, Apple watch and fitness apps etc so they can build on the online doctor more along with AI.

    Even the supermarkets will be gone as we know them. There will be more home deliveries from hubs run by robots and food sent out by automated vehicles and drones. Then we will have Amazon type stores with no staff. Walk in grab what you want and it automatically deducts payment from your phone or chip implant as you walk out. This is the future so what are we going to do with all the unemployed. It's going to be a big problem for governments when they have to pay so many people. What are the choices, kill a large majority of the people off, or maybe abolish the financial system and come up with something else.

    Your so called economy is dead anyway and the super rich are grabbing as much as they can while they can and it's f***k everyone else. Maybe they will use the money so they can pay for a flight to Elysium Mars while the rest of us fight the Terminator. Luckily we will be dead by that stage but our children and / or grandchildren might not. Science fiction or predictive TV has a habit of becoming reality.

  • I understand your pain, Norra, but we all know that's not going to happen!

    We must let nature take its course. Let's just try to keep the death toll down by protecting at risk groups. That, I'm afraid, is the best we can do. If we had done that in the first place, it would be all over by now and facemasks, social distancing and so on would not be necessary.

    I'm afraid that all we have done is to drag this out. We need to learn from our mistakes, and get real. Let's get this over and done with.

  • If our covid rate is greater than Greece (for example) why would it be advantageous stopping Greek people coming here. Surely stopping people visiting relatives in places like Leicester and Luton would do more to stop the spread. The scientists are as certain as they can be that the vast amount of people who get covid will be immune for several years. Of course, there will be a few exceptions. Locking people away is pointless, because as soon as we come out the virus will just spread again. We are better off just getting on with life, the fittest will survive and the old and weak may snuff it. The population growth is so great, any deaths are replenished over night.

    As far as your plans to give people more benefits, I would far rather go the opposite way. We are light years away from the mechanisation to speak of, so don't lose any sleep.

    The intelligent are being oppressed so the stupid don't get offended

  • I understand your pain, Norra, but we all know that's not going to happen!

    We must let nature take its course. Let's just try to keep the death toll down by protecting at risk groups. That, I'm afraid, is the best we can do. If we had done that in the first place, it would be all over by now and facemasks, social distancing and so on would not be necessary.

    I'm afraid that all we have done is to drag this out. We need to learn from our mistakes, and get real. Let's get this over and done with.

    I'm with you, but we all know the government have to be seen to be attempting to save lives. The world population is far to big and this is natures futile attempt to reduce it. Unfortunately we breed at a far greater rate than covid can keep up with. From a practical view point the country needs to get rid of some old people, not to mention the ones that are costing the tax payer a fortune, so every cloud does have a silver lining I suppose. The Spanish flu eventually went away by it's self, and this will do the same. If you believe the Russians a vaccine is on the way, but I am sceptical to say the least.

    The intelligent are being oppressed so the stupid don't get offended

  • who get covid will be immune for several years.

    More like several weeks. 3 weeks maybe a year if your extremely lucky. 3 weeks from an effective immunity perspective is totally pointless accept for monitoring purposes of where the outbreaks are, the outbreaks caused by the behaviour to reach those results in the first place. It gives the gov some numbers to say there is such a thing as track n trace and this is what we are doing.

    It seems this virus is more resilient to any antibodies more than anything else we have experienced which is probably why they keep banging on about vaccines but at the same time they want to reassure folk and make them feel safe so go on about antibody tests, wearing masks and the rest of it. There's sweet f all they can do about this virus now so this makes it look like they are doing something and at the same time can get things back to normal where money starts rolling back in again.

    In hindsight what we should have done is not bother with the lockdown and as soon as we saw the problem in China start, and even more so, when it hit Italy, we should have then strictly closed all the borders that instant and continued on with life as as normal just like we would do with the common flu and whatever was to happen would have happened. Let nature take it's course. I wonder if they where told it's the Black Death whether their would have closed the borders.

    The government have created the mess we are in by not doing something sensible about it in the first place. To much pussyfooting around and watching other countries to see what they do so we could play copy cat. This government are not assertive enough and not capable of making decisions for themselves. They are not leaders and are followers. Chicken shit scary cats that want to pass any blame on to to others and hold no responsibility for themselves.

    If we had closed the borders in the first place people could still be working, our economy would be better and there would not be all the issues we have from the the lockdown and watching other countries. The only industry that would have suffered would be international tourism and businessmen / woman would not have been allowed to go on the their international meetings / holidays.

    From a practical view point the country needs to get rid of some old people

    Why not get rid of some younger generations. They are more likely to breed whereas old people have been there and done that and have no intention or are past being able to breed. We can start with the likes of Harry and Meghan LOL That would make for a better world. Get rid of old people and you wont reduce numbers because the younger will breed more to replace them.

    TBH I think a better solution is to scrap things like IVF and we should put limits on how many children someone is allowed to have. Any more than one gets aborted. It's a privilege to have a child, not a right when your adding to the worlds problems which then has negative affects on the planet, other species and everyone else that are here already. When the worlds population reduces to sustainable numbers then the restrictions can be relieved, maybe up the numbers to two children per person up to point where there are too many again so go back to one child per person.

    The problem is humans breed and spread like a virus multiplies, we are the virus. We can try and reduce numbers by normalising and making it fashionable to be things like gay but this is not going to have much impact and creates other issues. But this is not a bad thing in the meantime as it can help relive the adoption and fostering problem but we need to abolish IVF. If you can have one child naturally then great otherwise tough luck or change your lifestyle, partner or other.

  • If we had closed the borders in the first place people could still be working, our economy would be better and there would not be all the issues we have from the the lockdown and watching other countries.

    True, or we could all have stopped breathing, that would have defeated the virus!

    It would have been totally impractical to seal off our borders in this modern world, Norra. We just have to accept nature for what it is. Let the virus run and get it out of the way. If that thing mutates because we have left it out there too long and then starts all over again, I shall be spitting bullets.

  • Couple of points here. The majority of experts believe people will have an immunity for several years after catching the virus. There have been a few cases of people catching it a second time, and there are a few scientists who believe immunity is short lived.

    Like me, you are probably old, but I'm not allowing the practicalities of allowing old be people to snuff it not to get in the way of my beliefs. We need a work force and people contributing towards the tax system and society in general. Old people put in very little and cost the NHS a fortune. The tree needs pruning from the top, not the bottom, and that's what the virus will will do if we allow it. People of our generation have a habit of over estimating our contribution to society. That said, I most certainly agree with you on the IVF issue. It is a subject I have rattled on about for years. The worst scenario is spending tax payers money in order we can help lesbians get pregnant, and then in turn bring up children in a totally unnatural environment. That sickens me

    The intelligent are being oppressed so the stupid don't get offended

  • Around 3.4 million people in England have had the coronavirus, new data suggests.

    The figure is far greater than the official tally of 315,000 cases in the UK and comes from results of the world’s largest home testing programme.

    Data from Imperial College London revealed that six per cent of England’s population had already been infected by the virus by July 13.

    The test involved 100,000 volunteers who tested for antibodies with the use of a simple finger-prick home test.

    As of Thursday morning Johns Hopkins University in the US listed the UK’s case number at 315,546 and experts say the new figures published by Imperial College will have “important implications” as to how the UK moves forward when lifting restrictions.

    As suspected many people have had it without knowing.

    Full results on link above.

  • Did they make people prick themselves twice and count it as two results by any chance LOL

    Numbers are drastically rising again in Spain and France. Then on one hand we have the gov wanting to relax things more, hence the tests, and on the other hand Professors warning that a complete relaxation will bring a rise of cases.

  • Did they make people prick themselves twice and count it as two results by any chance LOL

    Numbers are drastically rising again in Spain and France. Then on one hand we have the gov wanting to relax things more, hence the tests, and on the other hand Professors warning that a complete relaxation will bring a rise of cases.

    That's right, it will, because the virus is still waiting for us, like an invisible predator.

    One thing is for sure. It would be lunacy to plan on living under these restrictions forever. We just have to accept that normalcy will come with some risk. Further waves are more likely to result in a similar number of deaths as we are used to getting with regular flu.

  • Did they make people prick themselves twice and count it as two results by any chance LOL

    Numbers are drastically rising again in Spain and France. Then on one hand we have the gov wanting to relax things more, hence the tests, and on the other hand Professors warning that a complete relaxation will bring a rise of cases.

    Locking ourselves is only prolonging the inevitable. It isn't going to disappear on it's own until it has run out of energy. If your going to get it, your going to get it. By all means lock yourself up, but don't expect others to do it, because it is a waist of time.

    The intelligent are being oppressed so the stupid don't get offended

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