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  • Censorship


    Such an ugly word and it has no place in a society where democracy is supposed to be sacrosanct...... or at least, it is when some people are getting their own way.


    But what about the dissenting voice..? What about that person who goes against the grain...? What of THEIR 'freedom of speech'...?


    I'm probably within a whisker of being banned from this site. Surely I've pushed Horizon's patience to the limit already with my relentless commenting on Brexit. Now we start to see the Brexit gang call for the rules to be changed so that I can be silenced.


    And it seems that this demand is starting to gain some traction


    zz-1.jpg



    How can somebody (HY) who makes such comments be considered fit to be a moderator...? The comment should have been responded to with a comment along the line of:

    "The poster is not breaking any site rules and indeed, by making comments on a matter of public interest, by raising topical points that are currently in the news, is legitimately adding to the discussion"


    But that's not happening. In my opinion, the moderator concerned is showing bias towards a mob who are demanding censorship...... that a legitimate point of view, regardless of whether it is in the public interest, true, supported by reliable evidence or relevant, must be silenced because the message is uncomfortable to some readers.


    I won't die for want of being able to post on Forum Box. I'm active in a number of places and this site is just one small microcosm of the wider public debate. I'll just have a bit more time to do other things.


    If indeed I am to be banned or removed because I oppose Brexit, then it will be yet more evidence (as if any were needed) that Brexit is anti-democratic, and supported by fascists who oppose freedom of speech, civil liberties and the right to have an opinion.


    Go ahead. Do your worst.

  • Once again, you are off on one of your tangents, Jenny. Nobody is seriously asking for you to be banned. Did you not see the laughing emoji?


    The issue is that your posts tend to be very long - not because you are conveying a wealth of high level knowledge, but because you write six paragraphs where a sentence would have conveyed what you were thinking.


    I certainly don’t want to see you banned - we welcome alternative views being put forward. But if that could be done a little more concisely and politely, I’m sure we would all appreciate it.

    If my post is in this colour, it is a moderator decision. Please abide by it.

  • Once again, you are off on one of your tangents, Jenny. Nobody is seriously asking for you to be banned. Did you not see the laughing emoji?


    The issue is that your posts tend to be very long - not because you are conveying a wealth of high level knowledge, but because you write six paragraphs where a sentence would have conveyed what you were thinking.


    I certainly don’t want to see you banned - we welcome alternative views being put forward. But if that could be done a little more concisely and politely, I’m sure we would all appreciate it.


    What you want is for the message to be diluted. You don't like the detail that goes into them because detail gives you less opportunity for rote denial.


    More often than not, I head off your denials before you have the chance to make them and that's clearly a source of irritation.


    The message is what it is. I use as many words as I think are necessary and I make my point in my own way. Not one word more or less.


    As for politeness............


    anti-depressants.jpg


    "Keep taking the anti-depressants".


    How 'polite' is that..? Hypocrite.


    Unfortunately, you're a part of the mob, with your smarmy-but-patronising faux 'politeness'.


    I notice you never pick Mike up for his "Woke" rants and the amount of repetition in his comments. I notice you don't pick Ron up for his vindictive attitude.


    To be honest, I've been called worse things and had more invective aimed at me for other reasons than you can ever know, so I'm not fazed or deterred by it. I just give it back.


    And it's when I give it back that you then step in. I repeat. Hypocrite.


    When you get a grip on your own attitude, and start moderating fairly and impartially, you might get a little respect.

    Nobody likes the British anymore. We don't even like ourselves.

  • As I said, the issue people have with your posts is that they are unnecessarily long. They are rants, not discussions. It’s really nothing to do with the detail. If it was detail that made your posts long, there would be less of an issue.


    As for rudeness, I give as good as I get. If you don’t like it, you need to be polite yourself.


    Let’s start afresh. You are a school teacher. Present intelligent answers and be nice to people. I’m sure you will feel the love back in spades.

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  • Censorship !! The main weapon of the vile Wokeists. They dont want normal people to express an opinion. If they do, the Wokists invoke the cancel Culture and have the person censored and also lose their employment. It's time for all decent, moral, people to fight for their right to express their opinion without the Weirdos trying to shut them up. Wokery is very wrong and destroys society.

  • Well, let's see if a different approach works. If we try not to be rude to each other and state nicely what we think, maybe we will start listening to each other rather than just reacting in knee-jerk fashion.


    I agree that this 'woke' trend is insidious and undermines much of what we stand for. It seems to be used to stifle opinions, as we have seen happening in universities.


    I think we must challenge this wherever it surfaces. Silence is interpreted as acquiescence.

    If my post is in this colour, it is a moderator decision. Please abide by it.

  • I see the sense of humour bypass operation was a success. :P


    Why do people take what I post so seriously, do I have to do one of those TV type warnings at the end of every post I make? :/

    Young boys in the park jumpers for goalpost that's what footballs all about isn't it.

  • I see the sense of humour bypass operation was a success. :P


    Why do people take what I post so seriously, do I have to do one of those TV type warnings at the end of every post I make? :/

    I don't know what it is, Ron. The British used to make a joke about everything - even in adversity. Now, instead, we take such huge steps to avoid giving 'offence' to someone else - even if it is directed at certain kinds of people who are not even in the room - that we are starting to take ourselves too seriously.


    Englishment, Irishmen and Scotsman have certain traits that we can all see, but we are no longer permitted to make jokes about this now. It's pathetic.


    People abroad make fun of the English - do we take offence? Of course not. I think it's funny to hear the French talk about us 'rosbeefs', don't you?


    Anyway, please don't disagree with me because you have to consider my mental health.... :D

    If my post is in this colour, it is a moderator decision. Please abide by it.

  • I see the sense of humour bypass operation was a success. :P


    Why do people take what I post so seriously, do I have to do one of those TV type warnings at the end of every post I make? :/

    A predictable response. Claim "I was only joking". That's the usual fallback when called out for what you do. No, you weren't joking. You meant every bit of it. You're not fooling anybody.


    Oh dear...... this comment is going to be longer than a Tweet. It will probably be too much for the depleted mental capabilities of some but I make no apology. If you can't handle more than 280 characters, perhaps you're in the wrong place. You should try: Twitter - For The Shallow . That shouldn't challenge you too much.


    I also notice there is no comment from the moderator about the relentless, monotonous, continuous rattling on about "wokism" from a man who gave the details of this forum to extremist Irish Republicans, to bring them here from an Irish forum (Politics Isle) so that they might be able to use fake names here as a cover to obtain my personal information and data.*


    You know you did it, Mike. Denials will be useless. Mowl found you out and David confirmed it. That's why you were ejected.


    Mike attempted to put me in a potentially safety-threatening situation, those people are that dangerous. Fortunately, I was too smart to walk into it. Just for your information, Mike, Doxing is a criminal offence if it leads to other crimes being committed. Bear that in mind in future when you try to vent your hate by proxy.


    But of course....... Mike is one of "you" and so he's fireproof. Never any complaints about his "Boring repetition". No sanction applied to his activities. No criticism of his content.


    A couple of weeks ago, there was actually one day when posting on this forum was a pleasurable experience. It was so noteworthy that I commented on it. Doesn't that tell you something..? Shouldn't a pleasurable experience be the norm..? Hey, I have no objection to being disagreed with....... bring on the debate, I say. But the dishonesty, lying and lack of respect for any opinion that doesn't agree with yours - and I am the lone voice here - marks out the fascism inherent in the support of Brexit for what it is.


    If you don't like the thread, or the comment, ignore it. That's what I do with the relentless, monotonous, boring, endless TV vs Streaming debate. I'm not interested in the topic and so I don't devote any time to it. I let you lot do your own thing without interference or comment.


    If you don't want to discuss Brexit, then just leave it alone. Leave me to talk to myself. Can't you do that...? Simple answer: No, you can't. You know I have a point. You know I'm telling the truth. And that's what you don't like. And when you can't answer the points made, and you can't leave it alone, you do the next worst thing: Try to shut the discussion down. Silence the voice you can't stand.


    That, is censorship.


    Enter into a fair discussion and do it with facts and reason. Don't make it personal. And don't complain about one person pressing the point you don't like, while tolerating other voices who do exactly the same thing, only for something you do like.


    Make it vigorous. But make it honest. That's fair. But expect to be called out when you post lies and bullshit propaganda.


    Politesse would be nice. I'd like that too. But if you dish out the crap to me, you'll get it back.





    *It happened about three - four months ago now. One of the people who was involved has since had a visit from the Gardai.

    Nobody likes the British anymore. We don't even like ourselves.

  • A predictable response. Claim "I was only joking". That's the usual fallback when called out for what you do. No, you weren't joking. You meant every bit of it. You're not fooling anybody.

    Its that response because that's what it is, yet you accuse others of not having a sense of humour, you are typical you dish out your humour but cant take it when given back. The saying "If you can't stand the heat stay out of the kitchen!" springs to mind. :P:D

    Young boys in the park jumpers for goalpost that's what footballs all about isn't it.

  • Anyone who knows me will always know that I am forever making self deprecative remarks about myself, places I've worked witty banter between work colleagues was normal everyday occurrence but I fear that has been lost due to too many snowflaky people about, and before anyone jumps on this I'm not talking about workplace bullying there is a huge difference and the places that I worked the workmates would be against that and part of the banter and camaraderie between them was also about looking out for each other and standing up for each other, I'm talking about humorous banter between people who gave as good as they got, it was all part of the working day and made what could sometimes be mundane jobs, the time pass quicker.

    Young boys in the park jumpers for goalpost that's what footballs all about isn't it.

  • Although I agree with you sentiments in your post Jenny you are wrong to bring it up in a thread and make an issue out of it. If you feel that strongly then it's something that should be done via personal message to the person in question directly otherwise you should have just ignored those posts and continue on as you do. You are your own worst enemy sometimes.


    As for moderators it's a thankless task and it's not only the job of a moderator to moderate but one is also a member of the forum with their own views and opinions. It may even be part of the moderating to try and keep the flow of threads moving and alive. Kind of subtly direct it in a healthy direction by means of stirring it and keeping the peace at the same time. It's a difficult one to manage unless one goes to the bother of adding a footnote when officially moderating and not posting as a member. I have to admit from what I have read Old Boy is ever so slightly over stepping the mark with you at times from a mod point of view but not as a member point of view and should take a step back or if there are bigger issues at play here then other mods should step in to take the pressure off him. A part of being an admin / moderator is to back up your team so nobody can be singled out as a bully or whatever. A carefully balanced operation. On the other hand this not a big enough forum to be able to do that successfully without coming across as ganging up and is kinda more personalised or rather it may feel more personalised with so few members and being singled out. The trick is not to take things to heart. The biggest downside to being human is that we have emotions get in the way and don't think logically so can't see or think clearly and make sensible decisions.


    I personally don't believe Old Boy is bullying you and just has a very strong opinion. Maybe his manner could be a bit softer but I don't think that is in his nature and we just have to accept that's the way he is and take it with a pinch of salt. If you don't like it then don't reply and ignore him. He will soon get bored but I think you like the battle so go out of your way to aggravate. The problem here is that you are both like two peas in a pod from opposite sides of the coin. Your like an old married couple bickering LOL Geez if he was lesbian and bit younger you would be a match made in heaven. :D


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    As for Ron I didn't take his post seriously. He can mention my long posts next but I don't copy and paste and just ramble on like Led Zeppelin. ;)


    I think we just have to take things with a pinch of salt and try not to take anything personally but if you do feel strongly that there is specific issue then like I said earlier it's something that should be done privately to the person in question. I'm not sure why you have a quote from Ron and then start talking about a moderator when Ron is not a Mod. This just adds confusion and lack of clarity which comes across with a hint of manipulation rather than a genuine concern and is just a rant with a twist.

  • It's a difficult one to manage unless one goes to the bother of adding a footnote when officially moderating and not posting as a member.

    If we're acting as moderator then the post will be in the (blue) colour indicated in our signatures. I'll usually do it in bold as well. From the point of view of moderation we try to keep our own opinions to ourselves, try to be neutral and just enforce the rules.


    Otherwise we are just another member with our own points of view.

    History is much like an Endless Waltz. The three beats of war, peace and revolution continue on forever.

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    If my post is in this colour  it is moderation. Take note.

  • Jenny, nobody has tried to ‘shut you up’. If we disagree with you, of course we are going to respond. That’s what happens on a discussion forum. Putting an alternative opinion is not an attempt to stifle debate - on the contrary, we would expect a considered response.


    You haven’t been banned. You keep saying you are about to be banned, but you are still here.


    I have actually tried to help you in this thread, but you’re off again, fanning the flames and making personal insults. As I said, be nice to others and most will be nice back. I would rather discuss topics with you than argue with you.


    As for my rudeness towards you - yes, there have been a few posts. But before judging me, look how rude you were in the first place to generate it such a reaction.


    If you are going to be rude to people on this forum simply because you don’t agree with their opinions, don’t be surprised if they are rude back.


    I made an attempt to reset in #4, but I’m not holding my breath that you might actually respond positively to that. Pity.

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  • I personally don't believe Old Boy is bullying you and just has a very strong opinion. Maybe his manner could be a bit softer but I don't think that is in his nature and we just have to accept that's the way he is and take it with a pinch of salt. If you don't like it then don't reply and ignore him. He will soon get bored but I think you like the battle so go out of your way to aggravate. The problem here is that you are both like two peas in a pod from opposite sides of the coin.

    Yes, Norra, I do have strong opinions, as do most people on here. But expressing an alternative view does not constitute bullying.


    I wouldn’t wish to suppress Jenny’s views. But I have noticed that she rarely responds to my arguments, or those of others, which is a shame. There is no attempt to engage on some of these matters. If you want to change minds, you don’t slam the door on your detractors.


    You’ve certainly hit the nail on the head with your ‘peas in a pod from opposite sides of the coin’ statement, although we do agree on some things!

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  • Oh get a room the pair of you :P I wasn't saying you are bullying her but I suspect she feels intimidated and singled out at times. I don't know it depends if she falls on the femanine side or the masculine side of her relationship. You two just need to agree to disagree as you rub each other up the wrong way and neither of you is going to budge or be persuaded either way. How about a bit of respectful friendly banter and piss-taking out of each other instead without throwing any accusations. You can't help Jenny and she can't help you not that either of you need helping, it's just a difference of opinions.


    No comment on your new hairstyle then ;)


    I don't want to see Jenny leave the forum or feel she is being pushed into a corner. What we ALL need to be aware that she is in the minority on a lot views, she doesn't really have any back up so it's easy to feel pushed or banging your head against a wall. We should all hear her out and joking comments like 'can we have a rule against boring and repetitive' does not help even though it maybe factually true. It's better to ignore instead otherwise it's just adding fuel to the fire and we're in danger of sounding like an echo chamber. It's good to have opposite views. Who knows she may even say something that may even sway our own views. It depends on how it's put across which is where she does not help herself at times.

  • Well, just for the record, there are no hard feelings on my side, and if my ‘strong opinions’ have been taken personally, that was not my intention.


    I am happy to agree to disagree!

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  • I am quite happy to ignore anyone who considers that I don't like them for any reason, on the understanding that if they don't respond to anything I post I wont respond to anything they post.

    Young boys in the park jumpers for goalpost that's what footballs all about isn't it.

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